this post was submitted on 01 Aug 2024
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[–] EleventhHour@lemmy.world 143 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (6 children)

i still prefer the original official motto: E Pleribus Unum - From many, one - for it speaks to the true power of our people united in common cause and the very real danger of our division.

[–] otter@lemmy.dbzer0.com 43 points 1 month ago (14 children)

"E pluribus unum" = “Out of many, one."

[–] brianary@startrek.website 24 points 1 month ago (1 children)

How precise is this translation?

I've also heard "From many, one", which can be taken two ways: the same celebration of the individual (presumably over other individuals), or that the many come together as one, which is a much clearer call to action.

I prefer the Voltron version.

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[–] DODOKING38@lemmy.world 17 points 1 month ago (3 children)

I myself prefer E Pleribus Anus

[–] MySkinIsFallingOff@lemmy.world 10 points 1 month ago (1 children)

That's a great saying, but the flag is even better *

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[–] UmeU@lemmy.world 8 points 1 month ago

Many things come from my anus

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[–] Rob@lemmy.world 12 points 1 month ago

Also has a secondary interpretation: out of the many countries in the world, one of them. Putting the US on equal footing with the nations of old — despite not having a king with a divine right to sovereignty.

I like this interpretation because anno 2024 it also counterweights US exceptionalism.

[–] boonhet@lemm.ee 6 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Not American, but here's my 0.02 euros:

The strength of the country was always in its' diversity and the fact that motivated people came together to build better lives.

Nowadays there are people who hate the former and in terms of the latter, immigration is pretty hard and the H-1B is a lottery that unfortunately favors sweatshops (and yes, I'm salty because I'm a software engineer with no formal education so y'all don't want me).

I get that there are legitimate reasons for limiting migration (your own people do want to work too, of course), but it does also limit economic growth and influx of different cultures.

Being from a small country in the EU that nobody's heard of, the EU and its' open borders are sorta doing the same to us now: Don't get me wrong, it's still primarily other white people migrating here, but at least they're people of slightly different cultures, with different experiences. It benefits everyone because we all have something to learn from one another.

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[–] empireOfLove2@lemmy.dbzer0.com 93 points 1 month ago

The "in God we trust" slogan thing was first used during the Civil War, and only brought about as an official thing in the 1950s when we had to differentiate ourselves from "those godless Commies".

[–] cygnus@lemmy.ca 89 points 1 month ago (15 children)

This seems like a good spot for a reminder that Thomas Jefferson edited his own copy of the bible to remove all of the magical/religious elements and left only the philosophical lessons.

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 68 points 1 month ago (6 children)

And then there was Thomas Payne, who was as close to an overt atheist as you could get in the 18th century without having someone come up behind you and slit your throat.

There's also a long list of great quotes here from the founders-

https://liberalamerica.org/2014/10/27/88-founding-father-quotes-that-will-enrage-the-religious-right/

Have you considered that system of holy lies and pious frauds that has raged and triumphed for 1,500 years?

-- John Adams

And he was one of the more religious ones.

[–] cygnus@lemmy.ca 15 points 1 month ago

There were many spicy quotes during the Enlightenment -- the founding fathers were reflecting a common sentiment among the educated classes in Europe. Anyone interested in that time period would enjoy Peter Gay's book about it. It's incredibly well-written and much less dry than a book about that subject has any right to be.

[–] RememberTheApollo_@lemmy.world 8 points 1 month ago (2 children)

One can be part of the system and recognize its faults.

Yeah, there were some people sort of bucking the system, and probably some closeted atheists, but criticizing the church for its corruption and failures is no different than us doing the same about our government today.

The next line after the quote is:

Upon this system depends The Royalty, Loyalty, and Allegiance of Europe. The Phyal of holy Oyl, with which the Kings of France and England are anointed, is one of the most Splendid and important Events in all the Legends.

So not necessarily an anti-deity statement, but more an acknowledgement that the Church is a system by which European rulers reinforce their power and wealth. The whole letter to Taylor from Adams really rants about the church’s power and attempts to control people’s lives.

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 6 points 1 month ago (3 children)

I don't disagree. Like I said, Adams was one of the more religious founders. He wasn't anywhere near as extremely anti-religion as people like Madison. But that's why I chose Adams.

If you want a good Madison quote:

What influence, in fact, have ecclesiastical establishments had on society? In some instances they have been seen to erect a spiritual tyranny on the ruins of the civil authority; on many instances they have been seen upholding the thrones of political tyranny; in no instance have they been the guardians of the liberties of the people. Rulers who wish to subvert the public liberty may have found an established clergy convenient auxiliaries. A just government, instituted to secure and perpetuate it, needs them not.

And then, going back to Franklin, was him suggesting America should be building lighthouses, not churches.

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[–] fukurthumz420@lemmy.world 46 points 1 month ago (1 children)

reminds me a yard sale plaque i saw once:

"like a good neighbor, stay over there"

[–] NielsBohron@lemmy.world 18 points 1 month ago

"Good fences make good neighbors"

~Robert Frost

[–] taiyang@lemmy.world 41 points 1 month ago (4 children)

Ah yes, alternate timeline that they add "Mind your business" to the pledge of allegiance instead of fucking "under God".

[–] pyre@lemmy.world 22 points 1 month ago

one nation, mind your business, indivisible...

[–] strawberry@kbin.run 15 points 1 month ago

that shit always pissed me off so much

[–] merc@sh.itjust.works 11 points 1 month ago

The pledge of allegiance (to a literal flag no less) is really weird. But, the enweirdening was enhanced in the 1950s when the government added "under god" to make the difference from the commies more clear.

[–] Notyou@sopuli.xyz 8 points 1 month ago

And the national bird a turkey instead of an eagle.

[–] NineMileTower@lemmy.world 35 points 1 month ago (2 children)

My coin would read: GO FORTH AND FUCK THYSELF

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 8 points 1 month ago

r/NoFap is going to wage a protest!

[–] skeezix@lemmy.world 8 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Note that Mr. Franklin’s motto meant “Get your shit done” rather than today’s interpretation of “Get the fuck out of my face.”

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[–] itsgroundhogdayagain@lemmy.ml 23 points 1 month ago

A motto that many people today should familiarize themselves with.

[–] octopus_ink@lemmy.ml 23 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

Republicans: Clearly Benjamin Franklin was woke, and probably a communist!

(Because this would work against their efforts at book bans, their anti-trans crusade, their general anti-lgbtq+ crusade, their crusade against reproductive autonomy for women, and probably other things that aren't immediately springing to mind.)

[–] dmention7@lemm.ee 31 points 1 month ago (2 children)

I could be dead wrong, but I actually get the impression this wasn't really meant in the modern colloquial sense of keeping your nose out of other people's affairs, and more in the literal sense of keep on top of your business dealings. Which would make sense, since it was to be printed on money.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fugio_cent

[–] roguetrick@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (2 children)

That sort of admonition would quickly be used as a mild insult though, no matter how literal. Same with something like "set your house in order" which is a biblical phrase with a very similar meaning to what Franklin was going for, as it's related to there not being much time and Franklin relates his phrase to time flying. It's too direct for English.

I think both of them have a more specific meaning of something like a combination of "you're the master of your own fate" and "seize the day."

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[–] octopus_ink@lemmy.ml 5 points 1 month ago

That's a good point and I have no doubt you are correct. Interesting wikipedia entry, thanks!

[–] JovialMicrobial@lemm.ee 8 points 1 month ago

Benjamin Franklin distributed a book containing basic first aid, which included which herbs can be used to "restore the menses."

Thats an old timey way of saying inducing an abortion. So you're not that far off from what Republicans would say about him if they were actually educated.

[–] LustyArgonianMana@lemmy.world 5 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

He was later anti-slavery so yes, many would consider him radical even by today's standards (think of how people feel about prison reform, ask people how they'd fix homelessness or mental health crises, and you'll see a shocking amount of people are 100% fine with slavery)

[–] profdc9@lemmy.world 22 points 1 month ago (2 children)

How about E PLURIBUS UNUM ? Out of many, one. A good motto for a nation of people, and federated states, working together?

[–] abbotsbury@lemmy.world 15 points 1 month ago

Sorry but how does that help us virtue signal about how we aren't godless commies?

[–] alt_xa_23@lemmy.world 7 points 1 month ago (1 children)
[–] minyakcurry@monyet.cc 7 points 1 month ago (1 children)
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[–] snooggums@midwest.social 20 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (3 children)

It means both "leave other people alone" and "focus on your business" since the US was founded by landowning businessmen.

So slightly better, but not quite as good as "Don't tread on me" would be (if it wasn't currently coopted by fascists).

[–] otter@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 1 month ago (3 children)

They stole your hyphen, too!

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[–] Nuke_the_whales@lemmy.world 13 points 1 month ago (1 children)
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[–] solsangraal@lemmy.zip 7 points 1 month ago

what would he say about all the chuds today flying gadsden flags while trying to dictate how everyone lives their life, i wonder..

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