this post was submitted on 28 Oct 2024
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The Internet in Ancient Times

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Welcome to the stone age... or the bronze age... or the iron age... heck, anything with an 'age' is welcome, except our modern age or any ages to come.

This is about what the internet was like thousands of years ago back when it all started. Like when Darius the Great hired mercenaries via Craigslist or when Egypt invented emojis.

CODE OF LAWS

1 - Be civil. No name calling, no fighting, keep your flint hand axes inside your leather pouches at all times.

2 - Keep the AI stuff to a minimum. It gets annoying and old fashioned memes are more fun for everyone.

3 - None of this newfangled modern 21st century nonsense. We don't even know what "21st century" means.

4 - No porn/explicit content. The king is sensitive about these things.

5 - No lemmy.world TOS violations will be tolerated. So there.

6 - There is no ~~rule~~ law 6.

Laws of justice which Hammurabi, the wise king, established. A righteous law, and pious statute did he teach the land. Hammurabi, the protecting king am I. I have not withdrawn myself from the men, whom Bel gave to me, the rule over whom Marduk gave to me, I was not negligent, but I made them a peaceful abiding-place. I expounded all great difficulties, I made the light shine upon them. With the mighty weapons which Zamama and Ishtar entrusted to me, with the keen vision with which Ea endowed me, with the wisdom that Marduk gave me, I have uprooted the enemy above and below (in north and south), subdued the earth, brought prosperity to the land, guaranteed security to the inhabitants in their homes; a disturber was not permitted. The great gods have called me, I am the salvation-bearing shepherd, whose staff is straight, the good shadow that is spread over my city; on my breast I cherish the inhabitants of the land of Sumer and Akkad; in my shelter I have let them repose in peace; in my deep wisdom have I enclosed them. That the strong might not injure the weak, in order to protect the widows and orphans, I have in Babylon the city where Anu and Bel raise high their head, in E-Sagil, the Temple, whose foundations stand firm as heaven and earth, in order to bespeak justice in the land, to settle all disputes, and heal all injuries, set up these my precious words, written upon my memorial stone, before the image of me, as king of righteousness.

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[–] thisbenzingring@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 41 minutes ago

Hi. I’m Larry. This is my brother Darryl, and this is my other brother Darryl.

[–] whotookkarl@lemmy.world 8 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

Historians: if there were individuals who existed that those characters represent they were very good friends and hunting buddies

[–] ziggurat@lemmy.world 2 points 16 minutes ago

Like Achilles and Patroclus? Like Ennis Del Mar and Jack Twist?

[–] niktemadur@lemmy.world 3 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

It's David and Nathaniel, not... wait...

[–] Diplomjodler3@lemmy.world 14 points 4 hours ago (3 children)

How dare you compare this heathenish drivel to the divine truth in the one and only true holy book?

[–] southsamurai@sh.itjust.works 15 points 3 hours ago

Ikr?

Never disparage the hitchhiker's guide!

[–] DarkThoughts@fedia.io 11 points 3 hours ago (2 children)

It's annoying. Christianity ran around, stole all the cherry picked shit from other religions & beliefs, rewrote them to fit their own narrative and then shunned and persecuted the originals / predecessors.

[–] s_s@lemm.ee 2 points 59 minutes ago* (last edited 12 minutes ago)

Judaism. Specifically King Hezekiah.

And it wasn't so much that they (whoever that is) 'persecuted the originals' but that the Roman empire just kinda wiped all the other empires out.

Romans were really interested in all those other ancient empires' religions. The Hellenistic paganism the Romans adopted divided religion into three buckets: home/State-sponsored religious practices that maintained order, philosophic religious understanding and the Mysterious Religious practices. (When Classical-era Greeks would consult the famous Oracles of Delphi, this was their 'mystery' aspect)

The Romans really liked the Stately and Order part of paganism, but adopting the Greek framework left a serious wanting for the mystery part of the religion. So they adopted these much older, exotic ancient eastern cultures--Mesopotamian religions, Zoroastrian (as Mithraism) and Egyptian religions as mystery cults. Teachers would hold secret knowledge of these ancient mysteries and selectively share them with followers through secret practices and knowledge (just like the Oracles at Delphi).

Notably missing was Canaanite religion, including Judaism. The Canaanite cults had been largely state religions and were mostly wiped out by the Neo-Assyrians before Persia or Rome ever arrived on the scene. Some, such as the Phoenicians, had been Hellenized much earlier. Judaism was a weird one. Judah was a (basically powerless) vassel state to (northern) Israel who had been crushed by the Neo-Assyrians. King of Judah, Hezekiah allied with that empire briefly and looked to formulate his own state religion incorporating ideas form Israel (and thus greater Mesopotamia) He prospered for a while as a vassal state, but eventually his line tried to ally with Egypt against the Neo-Assyrians and was also crushed.

However, the people of Judah proved to be a resilient bunch and after captivity, eventually re-established their temple in Jerusalem, focusing on worship of YHWH. Prophets of Judaism added to Hezekiah's state religion and blamed their downfall and suffering on their refusal and inability to worship YHWH correctly, and exclusively.

This exclusivity eventually lead them to revolt against the Hellenistic Seleucid Empire who found the monotheism incompatible with their own paganism. Judaism was weird for a Hellenistic pagan. Jews didn't care if the pagans were Jewish or not (and still don't), their religion is about their family's relationship with the divine. Also the Jews refused to worship your gods. And they cut off the tips of their penises? There was just no appeal fro ma Greek perspective.

This led to them being crushed again, but curiously, for trying to worship YHWH correctly--opposite reason this time. This led to the development of the Messianic prophecies. The idea that YHWH was setting up the Jews for eventual independence, even if they were currently shackled. One of these Messianic prophets was Jesus. He was killed by the Romans with the blessing of the Jewish authorities.

Eventually, Jesus's followers claimed he was actually the Messiah. Also, he had somehow changed Judaism to be open to non-Jewish converts. Greeks could now access YHWH as a mystery. And also when they studied the mystery they learned he was actually the only God. This exclusivity created a situation where Christianity logically couldn't lose. Every new convert was one less pagan, but any Christian that sampled paganism was still a Christian who had sinned and could be forgiven. All this mechanism needed was a stable environment and time and the Pax Romana proved to be exactly that.

Eventually, Emperor Constantine made Christianity his own personal religion (changing the Emperor's cult) and eventually to Emperor Theodosius adopting it as the Roman state religion.

[–] aStonedSanta@lemm.ee 1 points 2 hours ago

Agreed. It is annoying.

[–] FundMECFSResearch@lemmy.blahaj.zone 15 points 4 hours ago (1 children)
[–] Diplomjodler3@lemmy.world 1 points 1 hour ago

If you don't know the difference, you're obviously a despicable subhuman who deserves to be cruelly massacred.

[–] EvilCartyen@feddit.dk 6 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Wasn't it Enkidu and Shamhat? Maybe I don't know my babylonian poetry...

[–] FundMECFSResearch@lemmy.blahaj.zone 20 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Enkidu and Gilgamesh are the two heroes of the story.

But Shamhat is a sacred prostitute who has sex with and thereby “civilises” Enkidu.

[–] EvilCartyen@feddit.dk 7 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Yes, but the similarities between Adam & Eve and the babylonion texts are between Enkidu and Shamhat, not Enkidu and Gilgamesh.

[–] FundMECFSResearch@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 4 hours ago (2 children)

Fair enough. I think this meme is just shitposting by implying a romance between Gilgamesh and Enkidu. I wouldn’t read too deep into it.

[–] eestileib@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

Gilgamesh and Enkidu absolutely fucked like crazy, what version did you read?

I’ve read André Finet’s translation.

[–] EvilCartyen@feddit.dk -1 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

I mean, I guess, but then she's actually demonstrably wrong :)

[–] FundMECFSResearch@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

Some scholars do actually think there are homoerotic themes. It’s debated.

[–] EvilCartyen@feddit.dk 0 points 3 hours ago

Right, but homoerotic themes in the poem in general is not the same thing as the story of Adam and Eve being inspired by a story of homosexual romance, because, well, it's inspired by a heterosexual story. In fact, Assyria (and Zoroastrianism) is typically regarded as quite homophobic.

Sorry, this is a shitpost, and I am here debating academics :) Carry on!

[–] iamericandre@lemmy.world 26 points 6 hours ago (1 children)
[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 20 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

You silly scribes and your gay porn...

[–] CheesyFox@lemmy.sdf.org 6 points 5 hours ago (2 children)

you can always call it a bromance and say they were just friends :)

[–] Dampyr@lemmy.world 6 points 4 hours ago (1 children)
[–] CheesyFox@lemmy.sdf.org 4 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

It's like every day is a sleepover with your best bro! You can even sleep together, cuddle, n&c... As a couple of friends of course :)

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 7 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

Oh they were definitely more than just friends.

[–] CheesyFox@lemmy.sdf.org 6 points 5 hours ago

Whaaaat? Nooo, can't be!