this post was submitted on 12 Dec 2023
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So you support the displacement of the people of israel?
Whatever country they come from or to new palestine if that's not possible.
Yes, all Israelis
1.The countries they came from. They are Jewish settlers. I.e they came from other countries to settle I'm palestianian land. So they should return to the (mostly European) countries they came from. Or they can join they can emigrate elsewhere if they don't feel safe lying in the bed they made with how they treated Palestinians.
Just like any other decolonisation effort, the colonisers need to leave or they can stay and try and integrate or face retribution for their colonisation. Are you going to feel bad for British colonisers that got caught and displaced during revolutions in the BE?
Maybe you're not doing the math on the age of the average Israeli person. There's been more than enough time since the creation of that country for multiple generations to be born there. They don't have some other country to go home to, because that is their home.
If they can't return to the country of their or their parents origin, then they need to go through the process of becoming legal citizens of Palestine.
Having kids their does not entitle them to the land they were born on. Russia has occupied crimea for 10 years now, there will be thousands of Russians that were born there. Does that mean Crimea belongs to Russia? Does that mean Ukraine calling for its historic borders to be recognised is genocide?
You do know that the ancestors of many Israelis are native to that area, yes? Why do they have less rights to the land and their culture than the other groups who live there?
Other than the few that lived their during ottoman rule the vast vast majority of Jews immigrated after the mandate. So the only way they have ancestors that are native is if you go back some 2,500+ years.
And if we want to do that than anyone can trace there ancestors back to Africa and you can excuse European colonialism in Africa the same way you are excusing Jewish colonialism.
The vast majority of Sabra have ancestors who fled and were exiled from Muslim countries in the region. More than half of the Jews living there are Mizrahi, many have ancestors who are native to the area. An additional 20 % of Israeli are Arabs who have ancestors in the diverse ethnic groups who populated the area, long before the land was separated into Israel and Palestine.
The separation between Israel, Westbank and Gaza is more a religious than an ethnic one. Since Gaza and Westbank want a pure Muslim state. But original the are la wasn't pure Muslim. The ongoing conflict between the Muslim and non-Muslims groups in the area predates the separation and was one of the factors which led to the founding of Israel.
The idea of European colonizers is just propaganda used to paint a black and white image of the situation.
The majority of people living in Israel are not Europeans. Perhaps read something else than just propaganda for a change.
What do you suggest gay and queer people, muslims and women who want humans rights are supposed to do?
You know, when you advantage a hypothetical displacement over an ongoing one, the implicit argument is that Israelis are superior to Palestinians. You're asking: wouldn't it be horrible for the Palestinians to do to the Israelis what the Israelis are doing to the Palestinians?
If you think it's unfair to displace one oppressed people in favor of another, then yea, I agree.
I think it's unfair to expect a people to just belly up and die because Jihadists are using their own people as human shields. There have been over 7 times where the Palestinian people have had a chance to establish an actual state. They refused each and every time. So I'm struggling to see a parallel between what Israel is doing (defending its people) vs what you are suggesting.
This makes it sound like Israel's existence depends on the Palestinian people NOT being free
The Palestinian people have had many many options to accept a two state solution and "be free". But they will never be free because their leaders only want the distruction of Israel and death of all jews. And, since the people and the rest of the world are intent on critisizing only Israel and making no moves towards freeing the Palestinian people from Hamas, they will NOT be free.
I'm Palestinian, grew up in a Palestinian family, went to lots of protests, "Kill all Jews" is not something people say out or appreciate. The problem is with Zionists, not Jew.
That being said, totally legal to march in Israel and chant "Death to all Arabs"
Ok. I assume you don't live in Gaza. Because then you'd be learning antisemitism in school: https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/eu-study-confirms-incitement-in-palestinian-textbooks
And I assume you don't go to mosque because then you'd be hearing about gharqad
And probably didn't attend these protests: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.timesofisrael.com/death-to-the-jews-chants-heard-at-berlin-pro-palestinian-rally/amp/
https://www.ynetnews.com/article/rjdkan0mp
Yes, antisemitism exists. No, Palestinians as a collective don't want to kill all Jews. The Israel government on the other hand is adamant to kill every last Palestinian or ethnically cleanse them with forced displacement.
And no, I did not go to those protests, and if I did I would have spoken up about it and not let people chant such bullshit.
And no, I don't go to mosques, I'm an atheist.
Ah yes and the antisemitism in books claim:
This is a historical event, regarding specifically the Jewish tribes near Mecca. That being said, fuck Mohammed and fuck Israel just the same.
LOL. What is the issue exactly? Doesn't say "Jews", says specifically hitting an Israel soldier, as one should when all means of resistance have run out.
Yes, good example of antisemitism, haven't double checked this though and don't really know what it refers to 🤔 pretty sure Israel ruined all sorts of historical Palestinian sites anyway.
About Dalal Al Maghrebi, yeah, that's bad, I agree, she should not be hailed as a hero.
The Israel government on the other hand is adamant to kill every last Palestinian or ethnically cleanse them with forced displacement. - please show your proof. And please don't give me quotes from several outliers which unfortunately have been brought recently into the Israeli government. They don't represent the majority of Israel as apperantly the multitudes cheering in the streets while the October 7th hostiges were paraded through Gaza streets represent the people of Gaza.
Everything on the news today. That's proof.
That's proof that there is a war on. No proof of any systematic killings. Based on Palestinian reports there are about 20000 dead, no information of course on how many of them combatants. So over the course of 3 months you have a less than 1 percent fatalities. I point you back to my meme and ask tou where's the genocide. In the ww2 bombing of dresden 25000 people were killed in just 4 attacks. Israel is doing everything possible to kill only combatants. As I mentioned earlier it is impossible to avoid civilian deaths as they are being used as human shields. Military equipment is constantly being found in hospitals, mosques, schools and under childrens beds.
Hmmm, so why does Israel use dumb bombs and large missiles that caused the Christmas Massacre for example? 🤔
Also what about all the dead journalists? If Israel can't help but shoot at people whose vests say PRESS, then why should I believe this claim of yours?
Israel has lost over 500 soldiers to date. Why put soldiers at risk? You can be sure that if all Israel wanted was annihilation then there are way better ways (dumb bombs as you say) to just completely level Gaza. Israel is targeting military targets which reside within dense population. This sometimes results in unintended deaths thats war. Also, journalists in war zone tend to get killed. Especially ones which embed themselves within combatants. I would also argue the actual number of journalists killed is much smaller, as the definition of a "journalist" is very fluid these days. But that's just my speculation at the moment, I don't have facts to back that up.
If Israel is trying its best not to hurt civilians, then why is an unreasonable amount of civilians dead by everyone else's account except for yours and Israel's?
I won't comment about not considering them journalists since I think that's a weak speculative argument with nothing to back it up (all journalists killed could be traced to an organization they worked for or freelanced for). So I'm ignored this BS.
What would be a reasonable amount? What do you consider a reasonable response towards people who decapitate babies? Bake them in ovens in front of their parents? Rape women while mutilating their bodies? The list goes on. What's a reasonable response for a country that has had this thing done upon it?
Israel is at war. A war it did not start and it will do everything it can to ensure rhis never happens again.
Another question for you, if Gaza is so dangerous for innocent civilians due to indiscriminate bombings, why isn't Egypt taking in refugees? Why aren't civilians allowed to take shelter in the kilometers of underground tunnels which were built using th billions (yes billions) of dollars the Gaza strip has received over the years?
I thought no babies were decapitated. This turned out to be disinformation :/ in case you missed the memo
https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/10/12/40-israeli-babies-beheaded-by-hamas/
At this point I think you're just a misinformation bot lol
Unfortunately, I know this for a fact (I'm from Israel, talked to people who were there). It's not even the worst thing that was done. As Israel is torn between protecting the victims of the attacks and explaining them to the world, the proof you require will probably never be shown. I assume you are familiar with the "Hamas horror film"? Is what it shows not enough to go to an all out war against an enemy that has very clearly shown its only goal is your total destruction?
And the slogan is “Palestine will be free”. It isn’t that Israelis will be exiled or some shit. It is a call for liberation of all people.
You mean like women and minorities are "free" in Palestine?
Pink washing doesn’t really work when the state you are staning for doesn’t allow interfaith or gay marriages to be performed in country.
At least, you know, they allow people to be gay or have another religion.
It's interesting how so many people stan for a place like Gaza and the Westbank. And even call for Israel to be abolished and everyone become a part of a new country called "Palestine" that murders gay people and openly hates people of other ethnicities and religions.
It does seem to me like these people either don't know much about the culture and history there, or they don't care. Which doesn't fit to the overall virtue signalling to pretend to be on the side of justice.
From the River to the Sea does not necessarily insinuate that all Israelis will be displaced, killed, etc.
At minimum, the Israeli state should be abolished. I think first generation settlers who aren't refugees and can return to their home country should probably leave.
Please go on. Where should the jews go? Which countries in the world would gladly accept 7 million jews? And by abolishing the Israel state I assume you are a big supporter of Sharia law. So no women rights, all LGBT people should be put to death, etc...
Did I say they all had to leave?
So only the gay and queer people, non-muslims and women who want human rights should leave?