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Sen. Mark Warner Forming a Group Of Democratic Senators To Call On Biden To Drop Out
(www.washingtonpost.com)
this post was submitted on 05 Jul 2024
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Or, its very late in the game and this chaos causes the dems to splinter, leaving trump ripe for victory.
You act like you know exactly what will happen, when in reality things can end up pear shaped whether we stick with biden or get a new candidate.
Polls and MSM are focusing on biden, allowing trump to gain ground. Whatever is gonna happen needs to happen NOW.
If he was merely sick, then one good press conference followed by a second debate might be able to turn things around, just enough, maybe?
But if not...
Nah, I just watched his "come back" interview with George on ABC News. Biden isn't dead yet but he's absolutely sundowning. I would give his performance a grade of C (A being the top grade, B being second best, and F being the worst grade).
Biden has no vitality, and as far as Biden is concerned a desperate underclass and wealth inequality aren't even a thing. Biden is grossly out of touch.
Arguably the President's chief job is not to execute the law of the land, but rather to inspire hope. He is too tired to be able to do that. But nothing is perfect, and he does keep trying, and we gotta respect that effort at least:-).
reddit is tearing Biden a new asshole for his (paraphrased) "It's OK as long as I gave it my all" answer to the question "How will you feel if you lose to Trump?"
They would not even give him a C like I did, it would be a straight F.
https://old.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/1dwe58u/biden_at_peace_if_he_loses_to_trump_as_long_as_i/
Brutal.
Okay but... at this point, how much of Reddit comments are not just straight-up Russian troll farms, or people who have interacted with those for so long that we could not tell the difference?
Whereas we have tankies on Lemmy, but they are different, and we also have some non-tankies as well.
Most people with a conscience have already left Reddit behind, unless there's a really good reason otherwise (e.g. nursing subs and other emergency services).
So I guess I'm saying, would those people have voted for some other Democratic candidate? Or do they just want to complain and serve up their word emo-vomit as "content" on Reddit, which the latter keeps rewarding them for doing no matter how irrelevant it is to irl?
They're not bots, for sure.
I no longer have an active account on reddit but I read it from time to time using the Stealth app.
Oh some aren't, for sure, but then when their words are copied verbatim they become so, unbeknownst to their original writers. So yeah, they aren't "all" bots, but some are.
Of course if you're going to wax philosophical, what's the difference between us and bots if we are both programmed? Maybe a bot is 100% driven by their programming while a human is 99% programming and 1% genuine creativity and intelligence that just slips through the cracks in our programming on occasion when we get particularly honest with ourselves.
Perhaps that's why people often say "they are bots", even when some are not bots, bc they might as well be?
I think so.
It takes supreme effort to rise up from hollowing ourselves out to be a receptical for whatever authority figures want to fill us with. Why, we might have to watch a whole 5-minute video!? (Tbf, usually it takes a lot more than that, like at least 7-10:-P) It's easier to simply parrot the words given to us by people quite a bit dumber than we know ourselves to be. They are quite aware of that, and make great use of it.
It is as you say. Are you reading my mind, comrade?
The Truth is surprisingly difficult to find, buried amongst so much active disinformation, but once we do, we can never unlearn it (...I hope, though I probably should learn to pretend like I don't, to survive the fascist regime to come).
The fascists do NOT have this timeline on lock. Although they will probably make some noise one last time before disappearing into the sunset.
We shall see. I was very wrong, thinking that Hillary would win for sure. Perhaps I am wrong about this as well - fingers crossed 🤞.
The thing is, on the Right they put in actual effort to get shit done, while on the Left we whine and complain why it isn't perfect already. Never mind actually reading a linked article, on ~~Lemmy~~ Reddit 2.0 here we don't listen, we wait to talk. Correct or no, the former attitude will win the day. At least in the short term. Maybe after that, leftism will win out overall, but somehow that ends up just as another form of fascism as well (don't ask me to explain that, I have no idea why, but I have both tremendous respect for e.g. the Lemmy devs offering their code for free while also not respect for administration of their instance to support repressive regimes doing e.g. genocide, which yeah the West is also doing genocide, but at least we the people don't support it, e.g. by banning people who speak out against it!?).
I really wish that what you say will come to pass. But... (1) despite what happens in this next election, the overall trend is towards fascist policies, in the election after that, or the one after that, and too the entire government shutting down every single time it needs to pass a budget causes fatigue where people just lose all hope, like torture to break someone down by softening them up before the big ask; and (2) Monday's SCOTUS ruling has already happened. We cannot go back in time, the only way is forward. I feel like people are forgetting that it happened, bc it's just so shocking. But it did. It's like climate change: it's not only going to happen in the future, it's been happening for the last decade. Do you realize that the USA is already a fascist nation, even if it has been thus for less than a week? Yeah, Biden may refuse to use that power, or perhaps he will go ahead and use it after all (quietly?), in order to keep Trump out. But either way, democracy has already failed. Our choices now are what flavor of fascism we would most enjoy moving forwards.
Edit: Sorry this is depressing. It was depressing every other time it happened to nations in the past as well. But those (nations) who refuse to learn from their history... are doomed to repeat it.:-(
Because on the right they more fully accept a Darwinian reality that for some organisms to live some have to die.
On the right much more than on the left a typical person approaches their world as an owner or at least as a rightfully belonging cocreator. On the left we view ourselves as the oppressed, as essentially guests or as interlopers in our own world, without the right to make heavy and consequential decisions, where we have to constantly consult with all our comrades before we dare to have an opinion, etc. The left thus is more pensive and as a result, smarter, but also paralyzed, unable to act without a broad movement or a leader telling them it's OK.
Of course all these competing qualities exist within all the individuals and it's a question of where on the spectrum one lands.
On the left we (wrongly) think morality is the bedrock of a just society, and thus nobody is willing to be militant and ruthless and confrontational. FDR who publicly and famously welcomed the hatred of the superrich was a unique jewel of a man, who frightened the bejesus out of the system so much they had to put in term limits.
People aren't wise enough to understand why nobody ever was assassinated or jailed for preaching or exercising morality. Monarchs are the biggest fans of morality (and religion). See Constantine's action toward Christianity. The most humble and moral people live in Saudi Arabia and North Korea.
Islamofascism is even worse than Christofascim.
In the USA I don't think of the servatives as "innocent civilians." In Palestine all the Islamofascists are also not innocent civilians. They are culpable civilians.
In fact we all are culpable civilians.
That said, are there genuinely acquittable civilians in Palestine? Yes, they exist, and I lament their suffering. And only theirs.
When someone comes up with a realistic way to parsel out the redeemable individuals so as to avoid group punishment, I will support it.
I am also totally against torture, using Palestinians for target practice, bragging on Tik Tok about killing and revelling in the gore, Netanyahu's corruption and fanatical hamfistedness, lack of discipline/professionalism and lack of accountability in the IDF, etc.
But I will be blunt. We have one Jewish state and 20-some Islamic states. For me and my world the last thing I want is for the one Jewish state to disappear and for one more redundant Afghanistan clone to appear instead.
Name me one other religion where its founder was a pedophile warlord? I dislike all religion but I will never pretend Islam is just like Christianity (which I dislike) or Buddhism.
I find it extremely interesting, and highly ironic, that Jesus Himself hated religion. With a passion. He preached love & forgiveness, except to those who would "lead little ones astray; better that a (heavy) millstone be tied around their neck and be cast into the sea" - the only negative words He said about people were to that sort, calling them "whitewashed tombs, fully of rot and decay". So I halfway get that religion sucks, b/c it is a system of control for the rich old men, and in the West it is usually white (and almost always cis+het, or at least present externally that way). As the famous atheist philosopher Daniel Dennett used to say, it is an evolutionarily "good trick", to convince people to go out and work HARD in the farms, while you kick back and shoot the shit drinking cool and warm drinks, having access to medical care and such while you actively prevent others from doing likewise.
Watching Hillary Clinton lose to Donald Trump in 2016 woke me up to the level of naïveté that liberalism in America has. Almost every educated person is liberal, as are most people in cities who are at least aware of the basic premise that "we are all in this together". When someone gets sick, they spread it on the public transit systems, and even a wealthy person may be impacted by e.g. their cleaning person not showing up due to an unexpected illness (or death). Don't let the whole red vs. blue state thing fool you - it is all rural vs. urban. And to be fair, at some point it was more honest that way - like a rural person would legitimately live and die by their belief system, so e.g. when they opposed ObamaCare, even though many did it without truly understanding what it even meant, others on the other hand did know what it meant, and still opposed it, even for themselves.
But that was then, when e.g. George Bush was a progressive, and then the Tea Party was coming in with so many changes, but before it could even finish taking over, the Alt Right swept it, and now we have... whatever the fuck this is, perhaps we should call it Trumpism (except they don't even listen to him - e.g. he "invented" the vaccine, and thus in his ego told people to take it, but this part they hushed up; so Trumpism has Trump as their figurehead, but even he is most definitely not in charge of it).
What truly messed me up though was watching CGP Grey's video Rules for Rulers, which isn't quite Machiavellian though it gives off similar tones in that it encourages people to open their eyes to some of those uncomfortable Truths: that "corruption" isn't so much a flaw - although it most definitely is that too, especially when taken to excess - as it is a necessary grease to keep the system working. We ignore this at our peril.
But now I see Biden doing the opposite sin: caring so much about the behind-the-scenes events that he forgot to explain things to the American people, who even if not during his 4-year reign as king, yet in-between that and his next anticipated 4-year further reign (of let's be honest his administration, though it seems increasingly doubtful that he will be much of a participant in it anymore) they are the ones who get to decide whether he continues or not. Therefore, right or wrong, the inflation situation, the events in Gaza, and somehow more important than either (WTF?!) his debate performance, was a mandatory key that he had to turn in order to win. But instead... he does nothing, and exactly like Hillary Clinton did in 2016, he just keeps repeating the mantra that "but everything is fine tho", in defiance of everything that people see and KNOW and truly FEEL in their daily lives. i.e., BuT tHe EcOnOmY tHo. Oopsie.
Trump will be a much worse President. But like someone playing a masterful game of chess and planning out in meticulous detail every single move forward for over a hundred, nay a thousand end-game scenarios, yet Biden forgot to handle the mid-game, and is about to lose, making all the rest become irrelevant.:-(
The fascists will win, because they deserve it, b/c they have opened their eyes to reality. And then we will all suffer under their harsh regime. Either that or Biden will exercise his newly-given powers, and perhaps become the very fascist that people hate, but nonetheless may offer people more comfortable lives than the alternative. Either way, fascism wins, b/c we are too dumb to take care of ourselves... maybe? At least that is my fear.
Just finished watching! Great stuff, thank you for mentioning it.
This is conduct of an ideal imperial subject: selfless to the bone. This self-effacement, self-denial, self-hatred never ever stays with just their own person.
The fascsists will never win. They didn't even win WW2, never mind today. But will they leave a mark? They already have via SCOTUS. That's not in doubt. Will they leave an even bigger mark before we clean them up? Almost certainly.
We are at war, and have been all this while. Cold war, asymmetric war, hot war, civil war, unconventional war, information war, etc. That's the reality of living in a world with not just competing interests, but living with grossly incompatible interests, incompatible worldviews, and incompatible value systems all vying for dominance.
In a democracy everyone is a ruler, just not exclusively.
But culturally we have been bred for generations to have the mindset of a subject. We are learning what it means for each to be responsible for their own world the way a monarch would be, but without the exclusivity of a monarch.
This is an evolutionary process. When monarchies fell, the mindset, the values, the sensibilities of subjecthood didn't just vanish overnight.
Democracy will prevail but there will be painful lessons.
I don't deny that conservatives hate themseslves - it's somewhat the definition of the brand (they hate others, but ofc it's always someone else, NeVeR tHeM, who will get their faces eaten off), but there is also that pioneering spirit of "go west young man" that expanded America both before and especially after the 13 colony stage.
Think of fascism as a virus: sometimes it wins, other times not, either way it loses in the end b/c it kills the host, and yet... it just keeps spreading doesn't it.
It sounds like you are underestimating the effect of the SCOTUS ruling. Or perhaps news headlines have been over-estimating it, and I haven't researched it deep enough to refute that? Honestly I have no idea which.
I think some of the reason why democracy is not thought highly of in America is the electoral college, not its effect that is much more often talked about, but here I mean its mere existence, acting to reassure people that if they make a REALLY bad decision, then big daddy rich men will come in and clean it up for them. We should all be much more afraid than we are. We should study hard in school, if we want to earn the right to vote responsibly. We should also treat that right to vote much more seriously - e.g. have a requirement where you pass a test to be able to do it, perhaps the same test that immigrants must take in order to become a citizen. How can someone vote "responsibly" if they aren't even aware that the number of branches of government is three?
I am with you. We should take POWER seriously, and in addition to civics power literacy should be taught.
Because voting and the entire Western civilization rests on the bottom up people power.
It's like when pirates had true democratic governance before any country did. Because each pirate was willing to kill every other pirate in their sleep, and they each knew that about themselves and each other, and made a rational decision to vote. But imagine if most pirates were NOT willing to kill, and this unwillingness was also well known? Why the fuck would they each get a vote then? Think about it.
That's the thing - we shouldn't all have a vote. The founding fathers warned us about if we did: the elites would sway those who most easily prostrated and gave themselves up to that, hence power would go to those most willing to do precisely that.
That is why the USA was called an "experiment" in democracy - it was a test, not assured that we would make it. The fact that we have come this far by no means acts as a guarantee that we have the ability to go any further. And somehow the people who routinely fall for chain email scams are the ones in charge.
What made it work, in the past, was that the elites enjoyed the fiction of allowing people to vote - they were pacified, and the real stuff got done regardless, however they wished. However, now with globalization and automation, that precept is no longer true. Mega-corporations don't need or want much of an educated workforce, least of all one that acts entired, demanding a higher share of profits.
I see government itself becoming less relevant than it used to be, as multinational corporations amass more power than those are allowed to retain. But to the extent they are allowed to continue existing, they become a tool of those in power to exert even further control. Meanwhile we talk as if We The People are in charge, but the more the masses say that, the less true it is. Especially when they refuse to even so much as read a book or watch a video about how things really are. They prefer to watch sports or reality TV shows, confident that big daddy will give them everything they hoped for, not realizing that what they deserve is so, so much ah... different.
Things are going to change, that's for sure, as we settle into a new equilibrium that better matches the updated set of circumstances that we see now and expect to come soon.
We should and will all have a vote.
Anyone who takes the time to educate themselves on the issues should get a vote. But if you don't even want to be aware that there are 3 branches of government, and like what their names are then... the vote is worse than unhelpful, it becomes an echo of the people who are trying to bring the system down. Then nobody gets a vote, especially when votes themselves are done away with.
Once voting becomes conditional, it's a precedent and then it will invite all kinds of people to adjust the conditions, to apply conditions selectively, etc.
A universal suffrage is much more defensible and harder to abuse.
Your concern is best addressed by making civics and power literacy mandatory, and sanely regulated gun ownership also mandatory. AR-15 is not an assault rifle. But people with a verifiable history of violent domestic abuse or violence toward animals at any age, no guns. Anyone caught in possession of a firearm while intoxicated, instant loss of the gun privilege. Armed robbery, larceny of firearms, no guns. Etc.
Replacing Biden with a younger candidate will not cause any splinters. Not a chance. Everyone will fall in line behind the new D.
Hell even replacing Biden with a ham sandwich, with a worse candidate, will not cause splintering.
The Dems need a candidate who can debate toe to toe with Trump, and who can project vitality and a vision for America that isn't a Christofascist monarchy and isn't a shithole with an underclass who can't afford to go to the dentist, who has to split their pills, and make decisions between air conditioning and car repairs. We need a leader who will take on the wealth inequality head on with major structural reforms.
I mean, Trumps going to win if we stick with Biden.
There are two things I'm confident in, in this order:
Biden won't be the next president;
Biden won't be the nominee.
The idea that we should stick with a candidate who has effectively already lost this election because shifting candidates would cause "splintering" is ignoring the fact that the party is already splintered. If it wasn't, Biden wouldn't be losing like this.
Brace yourself, bc based on discussions here and what he's said, I think Biden will remain the nominee. Yes, that should chill you to the bone, if it causes Trump to win. However, everyone seems too afraid to buck the system right now - e.g. Harris is not well-liked already, by anyone it seems, and stands to gain the Presidency handed to her by Biden, so she's not going to risk that sweet deal by trying to remove him. If he did so willingly, which he's already said that he won't, then that would be one thing, but otherwise...
remember that campaigns are weird. Even in the primary, you have to maintain momentum for as long as possible, and frequently if you look like you're about to fold, you're done. So he's going to be 'In It to Win It" right up to the end. Then he folds and every one is going to be like "well this was sudden." when really, it's not sudden at all.
I mean he's going to say that until he isn't running any more. I'm not clutching my pearls.
If I do start clutching my pearls, head for the exits. I'll be very loud about it at that time.
I think we're not going to have Biden as the eventual nominee; I think whomever we end up with will do fine (as long as they are on the right side of the Israel/ Gaza issue).
What if there is no right side to that issue? "From the river to the sea" means that both sides want to genocide the other, except that one side is actively doing that now, but give them half a chance and the other will do it right back.
But if we withdraw our support, gas prices go up, and thereby Republicans win the House and Senate. We only have the almost-majority now bc they went down bc of the deals Biden made e.g. with the Saudis who killed Jamal Khashoggi.
Arguably Biden may somehow be grandfathered in, but any new nominee is going to have to take a stand on the issue with some kind of position or another. And thereby they are going to get eaten alive, no matter what position they take.
I suddenly see why Biden is taking the Presidency to his grave - it may well be literally the only option left open at this point.
Edit: otherwise, why would you have added that last bit, "(as long as they are on the right side of the Israel/ Gaza issue)" - with all that is going on, it's not enough to be a Democrat who can stay awake during a sentence, as we've all been saying, now suddenly they also have to have the perfect stance on the Gaza issue too? You know, the "correct" (leftist) one, which also somehow is the one that will convince people who might otherwise vote for Trump to pick this new nominee instead? (so thereby not leftist at all, or else they will stay with Trump)