this post was submitted on 28 Aug 2024
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their vitriol is...weird. if they just said "i prefer..." not many would be bothered.
"you're a murderer." does tend to ruffle feathers.
Forreal, longtime vegan here.... Vegans (online mostly) annoy me more than most people. I swear we aren't all jerks! I'm probably a major sell out, I don't even have a problem with hunters.
Honestly as a linux nerd sometimes I feel like us open source folks have a similar problem
You do a bunch of work and make sacrifices to accomplish living in a way you feel proud of! Wonderful! And then you turn around and antagonize people who don't invest all their time and energy in the issue that you personally really connect with...! Oh... Wonderful... 🙃
As someone who's been working tech for two decades, the more assbaggy the linux user the less they actually know.
i believe you, it's something to do with being online.
Almost like ruffling feathers is the point when you truly believe most people are being murderers. You don't change society by being polite.
Activism isn't about being polite as much as effecting change, which vegans are doing the opposite of through much of their online presence.
Lots of activists change society by passing legislation, organizing political action and peaceful protests.
Irritating other people with half-baked personal invective won't get you anywhere productive.
You don’t change society by making yourself look like a dick and making everyone just want to ignore you either
A lot of us are murderers in that way. Or accomplices, whatever. The thing about vegans specifically is that there's not any moral need for it. The goodness to animals would make you vegetarian. Not having cheese or eggs is not the slightest bit morally better.
Well now I'm wondering if you ever had an actual conversation with a vegan, because they actually have good reasons for this. A vegan diet is simply the most consequential idea if you want to minimize the necessity for animals to die, at the very least (even if we ignore the various ways of exploitation) because male chickens and calves obviously have to be killed in order for these industries to function.
I've had conversations with vegans, and when one said that honey isn't vegan because it's produced by an insect (they said animal, but that's incorrect), I stopped pretending that (at least some) vegans have any logic to their arguments.
Wait, why is there no logic in there? Insects are animals, and honey is made by bees, which are insects and thus animals.
If you believe you shouldn't use animals for your food production, which is a reasonable definition of veganism, then you shouldn't eat honey.
I mean, fine if you do eat honey too, but I don't really see your point here.
I don't think bees are killed for their honey.
I could be wrong though.
You might be mixing up vegetarianism and veganism. Vegans also don't drink milk or eat eggs. You don't need to kill a cow or a chicken to get either.
Indeed I was, thank you.
You kinda do though, at least if you're purchasing those products. Male chickens and calves definitely have to be killed to sustain those industries.
You're not wrong, but it's kinda besides the point in this argument about honey not being vegan.
I agree, but originally the question was about cheese and eggs. The honey argument came a bit out of nowhere tbh.
Some vegans feel any animal explotation is wrong, even down to taking the honey the hive created for their colony. Bees are in the animal kingdom, beside plants and fungus category. Also, over harvesting, moving hives to rent out pollinators is creating hive stress and together with nicotine seems to account for a lot of hive collapse/death. We have a growing hive collapse problem, that will end badly for the world if it continues
Eh kinda. The working conditions of cows and chickens is pretty horrible. I could see not wanting to be involved in that.
But personally, I'm going to worry about improving the working conditions of humans first.
I mean, you can do both. They're not mutually exclusive.
Look, if I have to work 8-5 with an automatic milker attached to my junk, so do the cows.
You really just have no idea what you're talking about, huh?
Watch the documentary above and tell me that dairy and eggs have "not the slightest bit" of ethical concern for animal products other than meat.
that YouTube video sucks and you should post a trigger warning when you link gore
But aren't you the one advocating that this is okay? Why do I need a trigger warning for something so deeply and obviously ethical?
your deeply biased YouTube video is notoriously traumatizing, with the production house that made it providing aftercare tips. viewers report sleeplessness, nightmares, vomiting, lack of appetite and depression.
you are acting irresponsibly
I don't have a problem with openheart surgery, but I don't link videos of it without a tag
I feel like I'm being trolled right now. It's a documentary which is expressly about the extensive, systemic animal abuse that happens in the industry, and the first instance of that is over 5 minutes in. Did you not expect gore? Is this not like the most fundamentally obvious thing you could possibly expect from such a documentary?
Edit: oh, comment history tells me that I am being trolled. Interesting. Have a nice day.
I know all about your YouTube video, but unsuspecting people could be triggered, and it is your responsibility to warn others when you endanger them.
They're just filming what you paid for. You should've warned the camera crew of the documentary before endangering them.
I didn't send them to make it. I didn't pay them or anyone in the YouTube video.
So you're telling me that you didn't have to give the filmmakers a trigger warning that they'd see the animal abuse that you pay for and actively advocate for paying for? That in much the same way one might expect animal abuse going into a documentary on animal abuse, the filmmakers might have expected animal abuse going into the animal ag industry? Peculiar.
Your arguments are bad-faith nonsense, and I'm disengaging from this clownish conversation.
your accusation of bad faith is, itself, bad faith, and does not undermine the truth of anything I've said, nor does it relieve you of responsibility to protect people from a danger you have created.
I have never paid for animal abuse. most people don't
calling me names doesn't relieve you of responsibility, nor make anything I've said untrue