"It's NOT a gun control issue, it's a mental health issue!"
"Then we're expanding access to mental healthcare?"
"Fuck no, that's SOCIALISM and psychiatry is bullshit anyway!"
this post was submitted on 05 Sep 2024
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It’s frustrating because I believe it’s a mental health issue primarily. But god forbid we actually help people deal with their trauma and pain.
It can be both! And a problem with bullying in schools. And lack of ways to escape poverty. But having any changes that affect any of those things is verboten to the places where land gets more of a vote than people in cities do.
Never thought if describing the electoral college that way but it is actually a pretty good analogy
Don’t get me wrong, I’m for gun control. I just believe that if we lived in some utopia with zero mental health issues, it wouldn’t be an issue regardless.
Therapy and meds can't fix poverty perpetrated by the ruling class.
But I generally agree.
And did you know utopia means "place that cannot exist" while eutopia means "a perfect place". Not correcting you, I just think it's funny that euphemistic drift has flopped it fucky.
I actually had no idea, that’s interesting, I’ve never seen that. Gonna use eutopia way more now tho lol
That semantic drift happened in the 1600s. It's meant "any perfect place" for 500 years.
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It's not even a mental health issue either, ultimately! The traumas that result in mental health issues themselves have a cause, which tends to boil down to systemic inequity of some form or another. And our rulers not only have fuck-all interest in fixing that, but also a vested interest in actively perpetuating it.
I definitely feel some kind of way about this because dead children seems to be the primary issue from an outside perspective and ending easy access to weapons would be the single most effective way to fix that.
but without proper mental healthcare these people will then just have a knife party and take slightly less people with them ... so there's also that.
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Fuck those people. Universal healthcare to include complete mental health support and well being as a primary focus
"Fuck no, that's SOCIALISM and psychiatry is bullshit anyway!"
I’m sure I’m not alone in thinking that people who think/say this, have mental health issues. We are lost.
Education is everything, that's why they love to go after it. They don't want free thinkers but indoctrinated clones of themselves.
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They just say in order to solve the mental health issue, people just need more jebus.
For those who haven't heard, yes, there was another school shooting, this time a highschool in Georgia (United States, obviously). 2 students and 2 teachers were killed, nine people injured, and the suspect is in custody. (How they're not dead is beyond me)
I've gotten so used to school shootings that I see one like that and think "hooray, only four deaths!"
Unfortunately it did work out better than others, and yet two teachers and two 14 year old children were killed.
The FBI had been out to see the 14yr old who murdered classmates and teachers. Spoken with his parents, and him. He denied everything, no probable cause, so they put the schools on alert, and that made for a quicker response.
Which means this went really well by comparison to other school shootings, and yet it clearly wasn't good enough - two 14 year old students and two teachera died.
The FBI had been out to see the 14yr old who murdered classmates and teachers. Spoken with his parents, and him. He denied everything, no probable cause, so they put the schools on alert, and that made for a quicker response.
Oh, so we knew this kid was a problem but we didn't actually do anything but tell the school to be ready to get shot up.
What a fucking stupid country.
They also went to the kids house and investigated, but they didn't have proof of anything that would meet any criteria for arrest, yeah.
So they discussed with the parents, discussed with the school, discussed with the police, etc. I can't say I blame the FBI here for what they were able to do based on anonymous reports about comments made online. I wouldn't feel comfortable with giving any federal agency just free reign to arrest on anonymous reports alone, that's just opening a new form of swatting to me.
But clearly, its not enough, and that's the issue. For example, restricting the access to guns would have been good. Restricting access on a larger scale would be better.
Instead... We have two teachers and two 14yr old kids dead.
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4 victims is the minimum for it to count as a "mass shooting" by the FBI, which seems like both too many and not enough at the same time.
Yeah I was watching something on TV and they cut to a special news report to cover this. I was shocked. Isn’t there a school shooting pretty much every day now? Why did this warrant cutting into valuable day time TV programming? So I’m watching this breaking news wondering what’s so special about this particular shooting that can’t wait until the nightly news at 10:00, and the local police chief is giving a press conference breaking down in tears about how he never thought he would have to handle a school shooting and I’m like has your dimbass been paying attention to anything that’s been going on in this country for the last few decades? I would expect you to have a manual on your desk with procedures on how to handle this. Instead this yokel is rambling on about good and evil. I just smh.
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Once people think it's normal then that becomes a culture. That is even harder to remove.
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My opinion is that these shootings are a greater failure in this country than simply gun control. There is a LOT we need to work on to decrease mass shootings. While I admit, I am more on the personal responsibility side of the gun control debate, I am not against well thought through legislation. I don't think that most of the proposals for gun control are rational, detailed, and written with an even cursory understanding of firearms.
To start to address mass shootings, I believe that we need to expand our healthcare in this country. Both physical and mental healthcare. If people are physically well, and can get treatment that doesn't threaten to bankrupt them, then they will have more opportunities to develop better coping mechanisms. They will be able to seek healthcare options and not feel like they are left to fend for themselves. The isolation from a society that doesn't care or help them is detrimental, and while I have no studies to back it up, I would think that a society with a healthcare system thats prerogative is the patient instead of profit would help.
I think the aspect of mental healthcare speaks for itself. So people don't lash out and can seek other means of dealing with issues. I also believe that the stigma of seeking mental healthcare and it's ability to impact people's rights and job prospects is a hindrance. We should not make it so that if someone seems help, that they are punished for it.
I believe we have a big culture shift that needs to occur. Too much do we use rhetoric that reinforces that firearms and gun violence is the ultimate solution to a disagreement. "Fuck around and find out" when used in the context of firearms is terrible. Firearms should be considered the last resort to protect life. Not property and not your feelings.
Firearms are not conflict resolution! We need to work to give people better ways of solving and deescalating conflicts.
We need to work on our wealth disparity. We should be elevating our poorest so that they don't have to resort to violence or crime. As most firearm crimes are not mass shootings, we need to address the other parts of firearm use.
We need to work on our community involvement. Bring people together, break down the walls between us, and get past the cliques.
There is a lot we need to do, but gun control is only a small piece of solving gun violence.
Addition:
Stop the 24 hour news cycle and please please please stop naming criminals by name and showing their faces. Delete the "claim to fame" angle that comes with horrible crimes.
For community involvement, what comes to mind for me is: walkable neighbourhoods, libraries even in small towns and local sports clubs.
But there must be a minimum of gun laws: Buying, owning, operating only under license, storage at home in a safe and ammunition in a separate safe. That's really the bare minimum.
Regarding the news cycle. Yes! Stop the 24 hour, constant fear being fed to the populace.
You are remarkably safe in your own home. Get rid of the fear mongering!
Stop making national news of local issues. The constant national attention to some random horrible things that doesn't affect 99.99% of the viewership doesn't need to be highlighted.
I'm not against gun laws, but I'm going to disagree with your minimums. Anything regarding storage is essentially unenforceable until after a tragedy has occurred. It can't be used to preempt a shooting but only to punish the owners afterwards. Those sort of things need to be community driven. The gun community should be talking about storage more and shaming those that don't follow it.
It also implies that everyone's situation at home allows them 1) to purchase two safes and 2) to have room for two safes and 3) limits their ownership of either guns or ammo to the size of that safe. It also doesn't make much sense to have two safes if the person doing the shooting is the one that is buying the ammo and guns in the first place. It also places undue burdens on those that do not have children and do not have children that come into their home.
As much as it is laughed at in California, but when you buy a gun you either need to bring a lock or buy a lock with it. They are the cheapest things, but it's at least a minimum safety that isn't onerous. Even if no one uses them once they get the gun home.
As for operating under a license, what would that do beyond the existing restrictions for procuring firearms? Do they expire and what would happen then?
We need comprehensive laws grounded in addressing specific issues, not something to create an idealistic and narrow view of what gun ownership is or should be.
I think we should have federal programs on gun information and educational programs. We can teach people and build a culture on gun safety and storage. Maybe programs to subsidize the purchasing of safes and reimburse or reward owners that make safe choices.
Other countries have random gun inspections for licenced gun holders, to make sure they are stored safely. like you said, a cultural shift is needed; that would be part of it.
Anything regarding storage is essentially unenforceable until after a tragedy has occurred.
One could require a receipt or proof of purchase for a safe or a lock when buying a gun.
It also implies that everyone's situation at home allows them 1) to purchase two safes and 2) to have room for two safes and 3) limits their ownership of either guns or ammo to the size of that safe.
That's intentional.
It also doesn't make much sense to have two safes if the person doing the shooting is the one that is buying the ammo and guns in the first place.
We need comprehensive laws grounded in addressing specific issues
I was specifically addressing teenagers access to their parents guns, specifically to prevent school shootings.
As for operating under a license, what would that do beyond the existing restrictions for procuring firearms? Do they expire and what would happen then?
Like a car license. You may not be checked all the time, but every once in a while and it's a crime to not have it if you're driving.
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universal healthcare and basic income, paid with increase in the top 1%'s marginal tax rate, would solve a LOT of Americans problems.
Fear of losing basic income is a great crime deterrent.
Are you going to steal from that gas station if you could lose your basic monthly check for 20+ years?
You think kids would drive drunk if you told them that if they were caught, they would lose their basic income for life? Most think it's a slap on the wrist, maybe some community service, IF they get caught.
damn, now THAT'S a deterrent! Capital punishment? pfft. Losing your monthly living stipend? real shit.
Losing it for life is too drastic and isn't what any behavior specialist would suggest.
There needs to be a path to earn it back. For example, hours of community service based on the offense and that increase with each offense.
It would also want to incentivize future legislatures excluding people by targeting groups. The drug war and its imbalance towards treatment of minorities as an example.
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So we just need to solve all depressive disorders, schizophrenia, bipolar disorders, etc., across the entire country. Only then can we solve gun violence.
In the vast majority of instances, having a gun in the home is more dangerous for those living in the house than for any potential threat. Its irresponsible at best and at worst it will cause the deaths of those closest to you.
And before you say it, I do believe some people need guns, but you should be required to have a valid reason to own one, and it should be appropriate amount of firepower for that reason.
To "solve" gun violence, yea. But to significantly reduce it, we only need to make progress.
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Dark as fuck… but sadly too real
The Beaverton put together a nice, fill in the blank for mass shootings.
https://www.thebeaverton.com/2015/10/mass-shooting-in-usa-kills/
Edit: Added the Beaverton article
__________, USA — Up to ___ people were killed and ____ more injured after a gunman opened fire at a ________.
There were conflicting reports about casualties, but _______ from _______County Sheriff Department said the number is at __.
“I heard a popping sound and screaming,” said _________, a _________ at the __________. “And that’s when we all got down. There was ______ everywhere.”
The shooter’s motive was reported to be ________________.
Citizens of _______ were ______ and ______ to hear that something like this could happen in their community.
President _______ and Governor _______ had their _______ and _______ with the victims and their families.
____________________________________________________ gun control ___________________.
The NRA released a statement stating it __________with the victims, but _________ Second Amendment rights and _______________.
____________________________________________________ gun control ___________________.
💀
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Chief wiggum just standing there and snacking is the cherry on top
If I hadn't seen him working that Springfield beat for 30 years, I'd swear he was just transferred from Uvalde
Statistically insignificant compared to xyz
So much more people die from cancer than school shootings! Why focus so much on taking away my guns? Fix the cancer instead!
/s
Omg, this! Plus, if the cancer threatens to take over, we gonna need them guns to fight the cancer. #FlawlessLogic
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Wouah this is some seriously hard hitting meme content.
Mine was reversed
If it was a mental issue, the ruzzians would have a psychiatrist glued to the top of their murder tanks. And no, we don't want a steel tent around each kid to provide them safety. Just don't sell guns to regular stupid people. Wanna own one? Get educated in it's use first. Understand what it's for and keep it safely locked away from kids. The way kids get guns is thru failures in all these safety nets. I frankly don't trust other parents. If a gun was something that only affected you the owner personally, I wouldn't give a hoot. If it sometimes affected others, well then you need a license and insurance. But I mean, if live next door or upstairs, you can have an accident and I end up dead. So I would think 🤔 hmm this needs heavy regulation. To fucking fly a drone you need a license! WTF!
You do know this line is about mass shootings in general and not just school shootings, and that
A vast majority of guns used in 19 recent mass shootings were bought legally and with a federal background check. At least nine gunmen had criminal histories or documented mental health problems that did not prevent them from obtaining their weapons.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/10/03/us/how-mass-shooters-got-their-guns.html
And that article is from 2018 and the shootings have only become more frequent
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We know we've been through this a lot because the meme had also went through a lot of reposts.
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