this post was submitted on 21 Aug 2024

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I feel like a fraud because I am scared to take the DIY estrogen (sh.itjust.works)

submitted 3 weeks ago by lowered_lifted@sh.itjust.works to c/mtf@lemmy.blahaj.zone

25 comments fedilink hide all child comments

I literally got it from a famous trans author who is an anarchist and makes this stuff with her DIY collective and she offered me hormones and I was like all hemming and hawing on signal and shit but I said yes, why would I not, I have so many indications that I am not cis. It is supposed to be good for 10 months, this vial. But I am scared, I have never injected anything except for my GF's GLP-1 agonist for her. Also I don't know if I am a woman! I think I am not a guy, but I would rather be without gender! I want my pretty eyes to be focused on my GF's as I use a strap on her, my cock has always been pretty useless anyway. I kinda have tits already a little without any hormones, like I might have gynecomastia a little and I kinda love it. I want them to be bigger. But do I talk to a therapist about this shit? I feel like they are just gonna gaslight gatekeep girlboss give me spiro and estradiol pills, when I have the girly juice injectable right here with me. I want to be a butch lesbian, I have always thought of myself as a "male lesbian" liking women in a gay way as well as wanting to top and suck off penis havers too, I am a pan service top for all genders and I want to have titties too. I guess I could just see how my body responds to it. I am still kinda wonderin though. I was allowed to be genderqueer as a child in the 1990s but I was genderqueer as a child in the 1990s and my first friends didn't understand that I thought I was a boy even though I was wearing a pink cute dress like the other 5 year old girls, and then I was so traumatized by that day that I only remember crying and asking my parents to get me shorts "like the boys" and that magnet kindergarten was the crucible in which shame over myself and my gender and my ability to detect people trying to lie to me and take advantage of me (those pokemon card trades/ethics governing them really stick with a bitch!!) was forged. So yeah IDK if I am a woman but I am not a cruel shitty boring cis white man, I have never been that even though society projected that on me and punished me for not living up to the standards they set. Fuck that. I won't be a failed, sad man. I should be a happy nonbinary thing. Or a woman. IDK. Not a man though.

all 29 comments

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[–] LadyAutumn@lemmy.blahaj.zone 29 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (2 children)

This community is supportive of DIY HRT. Skepticism is okay, and caution is advised. But shaming OP for considering DIY or anyone for making it or using it, or otherwise outright telling OP not to consider DIY is unacceptable and will result in your comments being removed.

[–] princessnorah@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Based. I made a comment here a while ago with a* bunch of links to DIY resources. Was worried it would get removed. Glad to see this stance from the mod team :)

[–] 0x2640@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 points 3 weeks ago

I appreciate this greatly. Thank you for moderating the community this way.

[–] autoexec@lemmy.blahaj.zone 37 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

If you can afford it, it sounds like going to a therapist to unravel your feelings and possible trauma could be worth it. A good one will not tell you if you are trans, just help you along the way. If you can't then some lgbt groups offer help to questioning people too.

You don't have to rush it just because the vial might expire. Do it on your own time, experiment with other things (thought experiments, clothes...) if jumping to hormones is too much. Remember that it's not a magic juice that instantly turns you girly, you can always stop if you feel weird on it.

Also, do you trust her this much? I'm a trans woman on DIY but I'm getting mine from a source I've seen other buy from and talk good about. You also need to spend some time researching doses and what blood tests to do first too.

[–] TotallynotJessica@lemmy.world 21 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

It sounds like you want the effects of HRT, so even if you aren't this gender or that, it sounds like HRT is for you. Taking HRT does require frequent tests and careful instruction, but if your country's system has shit doctors and shit standards, you're gonna be safer going outside that system anyhow.

[–] FJW@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (2 children)

Post moved to here, where it should have gone in the first place.

[–] TotallynotJessica@lemmy.world 8 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

You replied to the wrong comment. Fuck the person who said that. DIY is less ideal than having professional guidance, but when the professionals provide such a terrible standard of care, it's absolutely safer to go DIY for many. The evidence is clear. Gender affirming care is both an impressively effective treatment, and the only effective treatment for disorderly dysphoria.

My life drastically improved before I started hormones when I simply came out, but having my HRT delayed was a burden that could only be alleviated by getting estrogen. It wore on me greatly, and the cost and headache of DIY were the only thing that made me stick with the broken ass system for over a year. I honestly would have gone DIY if I knew from the start how long it would take.

It wasn't about being a valid woman, but not feeling like my entire body was gangrene to my identity. I was a woman without it, but there was no substitute for me.

[–] 0x2640@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

think you replied to the wrong person

[–] FJW@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 3 weeks ago

Oh, right! thanks for pointing that out, I’ve now moved it where it belongs.

[–] 0x2640@lemmy.blahaj.zone 16 points 3 weeks ago

Taking or not taking HRT doesn't make you more or less valid. And remember, you can always stop it after you start it if you want to. Do what you think will make you happy, and do it when you are ready. If that means waiting to take HRT that's perfectly okay.

I'm not really sure what the deal is with the DIY hate in the other comments. Seems like cis people commenting on trans healthcare without actually knowing anything about trans healthcare (stop please). DIY isn't unsafe as long as you're getting your supply from a trusted source (which in this case I'm not sure you are, so that's your call). Doctors do not magically know everything, and they have proven time and time again to have no clue how to handle trans healthcare.

No matter what you decide, you are still valid. Not everyone takes HRT, and that's perfectly okay. Nobody can make this decision for you.

[+] Iceblade02@lemmy.world 9 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

[removed by mod]

[–] FJW@discuss.tchncs.de 7 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

Having worked in healthcare in the past I’d almost always caution against using drugs made and distributed by unknown third parties if possible.

That’s such a sheltered and privileged thing to say! The international de-facto standard of treatment for gender-dysphoria is very clearly and very quickly becoming DIY HRT, at least as the starting point, and pharmaceutical grade medication is usually too expensive for that. Trusted home-brewers are usually preferable, especially since their meds are actually made for trans people, rather than cis-people and have much more appropriate concentrations. It’s also not as if DIY is difficult, it’s just that most physicians are morons who can barely diagnose a common cold and therefore think that comparing the values in a blood-test to a reference-range is difficult. (No, I’m not making that one up!)

[–] Iceblade02@lemmy.world 1 points 3 weeks ago (2 children)

I'll keep it brief since the moderators do not want this topic to be discussed in this community. DM me instead if you want to continue.

The long and short is that many countries do have accessible quality healthcare and even more have it for those who can pay. I know that isn't the case everywhere or an option for everyone hence the qualifiers. OPs situation is not clear. Having encountered and read about patients who'd been harmed and exploited by bad actors I'd be remiss to not highlight what I perceive to be safer options.

[–] LadyAutumn@lemmy.blahaj.zone 10 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

You can suggest whatever you like. Whenever anyone mentions DIY HRT the posts are always flooded by people from outside the community telling OP not to take it.

People don't spontaneously decide to do DIY specifically when perfectly available HRT is right there. Every person who considers it has a reason why they are considering it. It is extremely western to assume that any nation has freely accessible legal routes to access HRT. Most western nations don't even have it freely accessible, and instead the path to access is completely gatekept by medical establishments arguing whether or not we even deserve access to it to begin with. The standard of informed consent should be universal. It's not even close to that. And that's to say nothing of other nations, many of which don't have any legal route to accessing HRT.

Long and short of it, you do not know who OP is. You are not entitled to an explanation of their circumstances or why they are considering or taking DIY HRT. You can recommend caution, you can explain why if they've asked you to. You can help them find legal routes if they've asked you for help with that. You're not entitled to come into this safe space for transfeminine people and tell someone not to take HRT.

[–] Iceblade02@lemmy.world 1 points 3 weeks ago

????

It seems like there's some fundamental miscommunication. The commment one of you mods removed never said to not take HRT. The entire focus of it was caution, other routes to get HRT along with a final encouraging note for the OP to try to be their best self.

As for the rest, previous moderation action indicates that the topic is too sensitive to be properly discussed in this space. Feel free to shoot me a DM instead if you'd like me to elaborate.

[–] FJW@discuss.tchncs.de 5 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

I am very curious to hear which countries you think qualify…

I might even consider moving to one of them, but somehow I doubt you can name three, even if I’m generous in what I’m going to accept.

[–] Iceblade02@lemmy.world 1 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

At the very least the Scandinavian countries. (Norway, Denmark, Sweden, Finland)

HRT is essentially free through a single payer system with slightly different physicians evaluations. Though as with all care within such a system there's a queue, or you can pay a private clinic to get it done pretty much right away and w/o evaluations.

[–] FJW@discuss.tchncs.de 5 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

At the very least the Scandinavian countries. (Norway, Denmark, Sweden, Finland)

LOL! They are all dogshit!

You really demonstrate the point well that you have no fucking clue about the topic. Like: I know several Danish trans girls, and IIRC every single one felt the need to DIY at some point, because of how badly the system was failing them.

[–] Iceblade02@lemmy.world 1 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

I've many "fucking clues" about the topic, particularly relating to the Swedish healthcare system, albeit from a different perspective - it was literally my job.

Please be civil and respectful if you want the discussion to continue. I'm here to be constructive, not get into arguments.

How'd they feel that the Danish healthcare system was failing them?

[–] FJW@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 2 weeks ago

For starters with the abysmal waiting times, which are frankly inexcusable and scientifically unjustifiable considering the well-established fact that informed consent works. There is precisely no reason why trans people should have to wait longer than diabetes-patients to get treatment, quite the opposite in fact, considering that HRT can easily be prescribed by GPs. Yet the waiting lists in all of those countries are longer than for pretty much any other treatment.

Then we have the incompetent selection of anti-androgens. Cypro is admittedly much better than Spiro, but properly scheduled injections of GNRH-agonists are much better and not done there. In exchange a friend of mine there who did trust her physicians at the time ended up unintentionally driving her cat insane, because nobody bothered to mention to her, that she shouldn’t touch other people or animals for 1-2 hours after application. Of course E is also only handed out as pills or sometimes as gel, because nobody can be arsed to prescribe injections, which would turn taking it into a weekly thing when talking about EEn.

I can’t really comment on the quality of surgeries, once they happen, because in practice you seem to wait for them until you are old. Probably because all the surgeons prefer to do knee-surgeries with their 30% regret-rate…

Now few of these things are specific, most of them hold in most countries that claim to offer trans healthcare, most notably the inexcusable waiting lists, but the Scandinavian countries are certainly not better. And that is before we get into all the bullshit about forcing trans kids to go through puberty because right-wing assholes keep attacking access to healthcare for minors, despite indisputable scientific evidence that this healthcare is necessary. And yes, that very much includes Sweden!

[–] zea_64@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

For taking HRT, your gender isn't the part that matters. Do you think HRT will improve your life? If yes, take it, you can figure out the gender later.

I was caught between woman and nonbinary too for a while before I decided to take hormones anyway because the cost-benefit analysis was so one-sided to benefit and I'm a lot happier now. I'm still actually caught between woman and nonbinary, I just don't mind that uncertainty as much because I'm confident this path is for me.

[–] princessnorah@lemmy.blahaj.zone 7 points 3 weeks ago

This is basically verbatim what I came to the comments to write out. I'm not sure how long you've been on hormones but I'm seven years in and still feel caught between woman and nonbinary. But I'm certain that feminising HRT was the right call, I'm so much comfier in my skin than I was.

[–] thoughtfuldragon@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 3 weeks ago

The medicines you take don't define who you are.

That said, estrogen (in pill/patch/injection form) would help with several of the goals you list. But that doesn't effect your identity, just how your body is shaped.

[–] FJW@discuss.tchncs.de 6 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

If the issue is specifically with injections, I very much understand that part and would recommend gel, which is what I use.

Checkout https://hrtcafe.net/#medications for well established and trustworthy sources.

(Edit: And to be clear, don’t feel pressured, do what YOU want to do here, I’m only pointing out that if the specific problem you have is being worried about the proposed route of administration, there are good alternatives available.)

[–] gandalf_der_12te@lemmy.blahaj.zone 5 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

“male lesbian” liking women in a gay way

this seems to be pretty common among us, i have the same thing.