this post was submitted on 30 Jun 2024
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139
Am I the only one who missed the Owncloud rewrite in Go? (owncloud.com)
submitted 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) by Lem453@lemmy.ca to c/selfhosted@lemmy.world
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The topic of self-hosted cloud software comes up often but I haven't seen anyone mention owncloud infinite scale (the rewrite in Go).

I started my cloud experience with owncloud years ago. Then there was a schism and almost all the active devs left for the nextcloud fork.

I used nextcloud from it's inception until last year but like many others it always felt brittle (easy to break something) and half baked (features always seemed to be at 75% of what you want).

As a result I decided to go with Seafile and stick to the Unix philosophy. Get an app that does one thing very well rather than a mega app that tries to do everything.

Seafile does this very well. Super fast, works with single sign on etc. No bloat etc.

Then just the other day I discovered that owncloud has a full rewrite. No php, no Apache etc. Check the github, multiple active devs with lots of activity over the last year etc. The project seems stronger than ever and aims to fix the primary issues of nextcloud/owncloud PHP. Also designed for cloud deployment so works well with docker, should be easy to configure via docker variables instead of config files mapped into the container etc.

Anyways, the point of this thread is:

  1. If you never heard of it like me then check it out
  2. If you have used it please post your experiences compared to NextCloud, Seafile etc.
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[–] ikidd@lemmy.world 49 points 6 days ago (2 children)

What puts me off of Owncloud is the new ownership. I couldn't care less if it's written in the blood of Christ, if I have to worry about the rug getting pulled out from under me for self-hosting, it's a no-go for me, Joe.

Nextcloud works well for me and has for years. The people that don't like it can go use this, and we'll see you back in a couple of years when it goes open-core or worse.

[–] Lem453@lemmy.ca 4 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (1 children)

Ya it was bought by kiteworks which provides document management services for corps (which explains why that mention traceable file access in their features a lot).

~~That being said, they bought them in 2014 it seems and it's been a decade now~~ Correcting: they were bought very recently, they have been accepting corporate funding for more than a decade however. That's not bad in and of itself.

[–] ikidd@lemmy.world 11 points 6 days ago (2 children)

I have no issue with corporate funding. I have an issue when a company gets to make all the decisions. Lot of good software has gone to hell when the shareholders need profit now instead of seeing a long term vision.

We'll see, but I've been around this rodeo enough to just avoid it from the start and take some pain now instead of putting in effort that's going to be wasted later.

[–] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 6 points 6 days ago (1 children)

If it goes bad fork it. Just look at what is now the fossify apps

[–] roofuskit@lemmy.world 3 points 5 days ago

I mean... We already have a very well built fork.

[–] acockworkorange@mander.xyz 5 points 6 days ago

Open source or bust

[–] massacre@lemmy.world 1 points 6 days ago

Nextcloud needs to port over some of the old OC Documentation. Their own docs make all kinds of references and it's always something esoteric.

[–] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 13 points 6 days ago (1 children)

I personally like Nextcloud even though it is a pain

[–] Pika@sh.itjust.works 17 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (7 children)

I personally will never use nextcloud, it is nice interface side but while I was researching the product I came across concerns with the security of the product. Those concerns have since then been fixed but the way they resolved the issue has made me lose all respect for them as a secure Cloud solution.

Basically when they first introduced encrypting folders, there was a bug in the encryption program, and the only thing that ever would be encrypted was The Parent Directory but any subfolder in that directory would proceed to not be encrypted. The issue with that is that unless you had server-side access to view the files you had no way of knowing that your files weren't actually being encrypted.

All this is fine it's a beta feature right? Except for when I read the GitHub issue on the report, they gaslit the reporter who reported the issue saying that despite the fact that it is advertised as feature on their stable branch, the feature was actually in beta status so therefore should not be used in a production environment, and then on top of , the feature was never removed from their features list, and proceeded to take another 3 months before anyone even started working on the issue report.

This might not seem like a big deal to a lot of people, but as someone who is paranoid over security features, the projects inaction over something as critical as that while trying to advertise themselves as being a business grade solution made me flee hardcore

That being said I fully agree with you out of the different Cloud platforms that I've had, nextCloud does seem to be the most refined and even has the ability to emulate an office suite which is really nice, I just can't trust them, I just ended up using syncthing and took the hit on the feature set

[–] vzq@lemmy.blahaj.zone 7 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Ugh. I know that feeling. That’s why I’ve blacklisted salt stack.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5993959

There’s a particularly toxic combination of ignorance, laziness, NIH and hubris that you need to make a mistake like that, and I want it nowhere near my servers.

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[–] skittlebrau@lemmy.world 7 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (1 children)

I would have used Owncloud Infinite Scale but the fact you can’t use your own existing files makes it a complete non-starter for me. I don’t want my files locked behind Decomposed FS.

Unless I’ve read things wrong, which is entirely possible.

[–] rearview@lemmy.zip 1 points 3 days ago (1 children)

FYI there is an upcoming storage driver that can solve this issue

[–] skittlebrau@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago

That’s good to hear. Looks like something worth revisiting once it’s been tested well.

[–] Decronym@lemmy.decronym.xyz 4 points 6 days ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Acronyms, initialisms, abbreviations, contractions, and other phrases which expand to something larger, that I've seen in this thread:

Fewer Letters More Letters
IoT Internet of Things for device controllers
NAS Network-Attached Storage
SSD Solid State Drive mass storage

3 acronyms in this thread; the most compressed thread commented on today has 8 acronyms.

[Thread #841 for this sub, first seen 1st Jul 2024, 16:05] [FAQ] [Full list] [Contact] [Source code]

[–] hendrik@palaver.p3x.de 6 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (2 children)

Is it Free Software? In the repo is a LICENSE file, saying it's Apache licensed. But I also found an EULA saying it's not Free Software...

[–] imsodin@infosec.pub 2 points 6 days ago (1 children)

That's indeed confusing. The wording linked below suggests the eula is for packages distributed by owncloud. so to my understanding the source itself and any third party packages don't need to care about it.

https://github.com/owncloud/ocis?tab=readme-ov-file#end-user-license-agreement

[–] hendrik@palaver.p3x.de 1 points 6 days ago

Apache isn't a copyleft license. I guess they (and everyone) can just copy or compile it, make it a derivative work and say it's now non-free and terms and conditions apply.

I mean the GitHub repo has a license file which says it's Apache 2.0. And 3h) of the EULA says it doesn't apply to open source components. So it kinda doesn't apply to itself. I think you're right, it's Free Software after all and them saying "Some builds [...]" means it's the binaries distributed by them. IANAL and it kinda contradicts the Apache license which explicitly states I am allowed to redistribute copies both modified and not modified and both in object and source form. I'm not sure why they do it and if there are components missing in the GitHub repo.

[–] Lem453@lemmy.ca 1 points 6 days ago (1 children)

I only read the beginning but it says you can use it for private deployments but can't use it commercially. Seems reasonable. Any specific issues?

[–] hendrik@palaver.p3x.de 6 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Hmm. I guess that works, too. I'm just a nerd and really like Free Software. Almost exclusively use it. My phone runs a custom ROM with just a few unfree apps and without Google services, all my computers run Linux. Even the internet router does, and my IoT smart sockets run Tasmota or ESPHome. I like the 4 freedoms and the culture behind it. I participate and regularly contribute. All of that is mostly personal preference. I guess I could as well live comfortably with using Google Drive, but I choose not to. Source-available software would allow me to look at the code, something proprietary software doesn't allow. But that's pretty much it. I often can't remix and share it as I like. I don't have the freedom to decide to use it as it pleases me. And depending on the exact license, I can't even invite my friends and family to use the services I set up...

It's just the line I draw. And with the software I really rely on and use daily, I'm pretty strict. Either it provides me with the Four Essential Freedoms of Free Software as lined out by RMS in the eighties, or I don't volunteer to use it. I have no issues though with other people making different choices.

[–] JubilantJaguar@lemmy.world 3 points 6 days ago (2 children)

Seafile is not FOSS, as I understand it. But I tried it anyway, since I also found Nextcloud bloated.

In the end I went back to the purest strategy of all: peer-to-peer. My files are synced between devices over the local network using ssh, rsync and unison and never touch an internet server.

[–] bashfulrobot@hachyderm.io 4 points 6 days ago

@JubilantJaguar I do similar but with syncthing. It’s treated me very well so far.

[–] TCB13@lemmy.world 3 points 6 days ago

Maybe the NextCloud guys will follow... oh wait that would just be yet another perpetually half-finished NC thing.

[–] toxicyeti@sh.itjust.works 2 points 6 days ago

I've been running OC10 for a while now and have hit a few bumps here and there. I didn't realize OCIS is available as a self hosted thing. Since first reading this thread a while ago I've been working on getting it running. Using docker I manage to get it to open to a blank blue page where I'm supposed to be able to log in but the form doesn't show up no matter what browser I use. I may look into it again in the future...

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