Tiktok also didn’t censor the major protests in France like Facebook and Twitter did at the time. i hav downloaded some videos with Tiktok video downloader but after that i have deleted all the data.
this post was submitted on 15 Nov 2023
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It might be a surprise to Americans that many people think that Israelis are evil bastards.
Algorithm probably plays a sizeable part in that, but as an older gen Z fella I have become indifferent to both countries of this conflict. Both Israel and Palestine just race with each other who can check the most boxes in the Geneva Convention rules list. Just leave those 2 to sort this mess out for themselves, It's not like we get a Holy Site bonus effect by owning Jerusalem.
Or just put a stop on this, but this is a naive thinking.
That’s pretty reductive on the Palestinian side no?
Considering more than half the populous wasn’t even born when Hamas took power.
To be fair to them, it's not as though the Israel Palestine conflict is black and white. It is pretty well known to be one of the most complex conflicts in human history.
Just about any statement that isn't very well researched and laboriously constructed is like 95% likely to be reductive to some and offensive to others.
I'm sure someone reads this post as reductive, and I am only tangentially referring to the conflict.
Edit: beyond this comment we see people continuing to try to distill a multigenerational war down to a paragraph. Brilliant. Y'all should start writing history books since y'all have such a firm grasp on it all!
It is pretty well known to be one of the most complex conflicts in human history.
It’s really not. It’s a land grab by a colonist ethno-state that drummed up some bullshit about that land being their destiny when they really came from what is now known as Iraq (and honestly who cares where). They intentionally make the issue “complicated” by putting ethnicity at its center, making even valid criticisms of this colonization punishable as a hate crime. But in the end, it’s not confusing. It’s just a land-grab wrapped in an ethnic/religious skin sort of like a Trojan horse.
I think some citation is necessary for the assertion that the Jewish people were not historically from the Levant region, and have no ancestoral "claims" in Jerusalem and the surrounding territory. I would love to see some anthropology studies or papers on the bronze age Israelites being proto-Asyrian or Persian and not one of the Canaanite tribes.
I'd also like to point out that basically every war ever has been and will probably be a land grab, wrapped up in some rationalized or causative skin. That stretch of land in particular has been conquered over and over again throughout human history, and the inhabitants forcibly immigrated and emigrated during many of these changes of power. Mesopotamia has been birthing empires since humans discovered it and it became a cradle of human civilization.
By your logic, they should share the land. That would also be an acceptable solution as well. Probably better, actually.
How do you feel about that? I’d love it if they could coexist peacefully, wouldn’t you?
The amount of pro Palestinian support is overwhelming everywhere. Only newspapers and Reddit bots and paid shills are still spreading IDF propaganda. The rest of the world sees israel for the Nazi's they are.
I think the Israeli government is authoritarian, and their scorched earth tactics against Palestinians are war crimes, but you're not doing the cause any favors by invoking the Nazis. Criticize their actual behavior.
The comparisons to the Nazis are actually inescapable. I struggle to think of a centrally orchestrated and mechanized system of apartheid/oppression and now genocide that's more similar.
The Israelis have set up a systematic means of rounding up and murdering people until their entire race is removed from existence?
I hadn't heard.
...you mean at the military checkpoints where Palestinians routinely disappear? How about the fact that Israel conducts human medical experiments on prisoners. Or the systematic rape of Palestinian women. How about the systematic attacks on Palestinian infrastructure that leaves 95% of Gaza without access to clean water. And that was before this current mess.
Grow the fuck up and open your eyes. Israelis are straight up evil.
The Israeli government is straight up evil, maybe.
The Israeli people have been targets of precise statements from multiple neighbors over the years telling them they would be exterminated as soon as the opportunity arose.
Put yourself in that position and tell me you wouldn't support a right wing militant government that ran on a platform of hard borders and strong military.
How many wars of aggression have been waged against Israel since its founding? How many terrorist attacks? If the nations surrounding them put down their weapons and accepted them, there would be peace in the region. If the Israelis put down their weapons they would be murdered en masse.
How would you like a populace that came within a hair's breadth of systematic extermination to react when they move to an area and are immediately painted as liars by neighbors who are Holocaust deniers and express the desire to finish the job?
Also if your argument is strong enough there's no need to add that last part. It makes you seem weak and devalues any merit in your words, of which there is plenty. Nobody wants to see people getting hurt, but to fail to differentiate between the Israeli government and the Israeli people, and to ignore the situation they are in and the precursor to the establishment of the state of Israel, is a mistake.
They chose for religious reasons to slowly invade and genocide a people in an area that was extremely hostile to them.
Historically Jewish people have been given land in Spain and Italy to found their own nation. Both times they sold it and invaded Israel in history.
I have zero sympathy for them, because historically, they've been the invading aggressors to the region because they feel they have some sort of religious right to it, and since I'm anti-theist and believe religion is the root of all evil seeing both sides die in this conflict is kind of desirable to me.
Children get indoctrinated into Islam and Judaism and inherit this conflict and its derived suffering from their parents. As an anti-theist, you should be able to see them as victims, rather than see the conflict as something positive.
Am I a poor little victom instead of an oppressor because I didn't personally create patriarchy, white supremacy, ableism, heteronormativity? If I keep supporting those systems, at least when I'm an adult, I am an oppressor and fully responsible.
The problem is their behavior and rhetoric towards Palestine resembles a sentiment shared by the OG Nazis
The problem is when you mention Nazis to Jews, the first things they'll think of are Zyklon B, Babi Yar, the piles of children's shoes at Auschwitz, Mengele, that sort of thing.
And while what's going on in Israel is terrible, it's not Mengele terrible, Babi Yar terrible, or Treblinka terrible. So they write you off as just another antisemite, rather than listening to your point.
And yet that was only the very end. The stuff that came before that might as well be a mirror to the way Israel is treating the Palestinians.
No, not really. Nazi Germany lasted from 1933-1945.
From 1933 to 1939, things were mostly non-lethal: boycotting and vandalizing shops, banning Jews from public service or practicing law, harassing Jews, etc. The basic idea was to get Jews to emigrate out of Germany.
The first open ghettos were established in 1939, while the massacres really started in 1941.
If you're going to compare Gaza to part of Nazi Germany, the best comparison is to the closed ghettos that were established in 1940, like the Warsaw ghetto. The period between the establishment of the closed ghettos and the beginning of the mass killings was way, way shorter than the mass killings. Of the 12 year span of Nazi Germany, the best comparison is to a period that lasted for about a year or so, 7 years in.
Nazi Germany really isn't a great historical comparison to Israel. Honestly, a better comparison is to the US's treatment of Native Americans, though it's still not a perfect analogy. The dream of Israel's far right isn't to murder every last Palestinian, it's manifest destiny; an Israel stretching from the river to the sea even if there's a few small reservations on it.
Netanyahu and his cohorts have explicitly said they believe they need to kill every last Palestinian. https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2023/11/benjamin-netanyahu-amalek-israel-palestine-gaza-saul-samuel-old-testament/
I read this, and from what I can tell, he explicitly said they believe they need to kill every last member of Hamas, and a different unrelated person wrote an essay about how they need to kill all Palestinians?
Well, thats only a relevant distinction if they meaningfully differentiate between Hamas and Palestinian. Considering they've talked about using nukes, that they think sacrificing an entire hospital full of innocents to maybe kill a few Hamas, and that we DAMN WELL KNOW how racism means generalizing anyone of a group to be the worst kind of that group, and the fact that the totally un-Hamas west bank is getting ethnically cleansed too, it's incredibly naive to think they'll leave any reasonable amount of palestinians alive.