this post was submitted on 10 Oct 2024
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Old-fashioned high seas pirating may have been stealing, but the modern copyright infringement form has never been stealing.
A key aspect of stealing is that you're depriving the owner of some kind of property. While you have that property, they don't, and they can't use it. Copyright infringement doesn't deprive the owner of anything. The only thing they lose is the government-granted monopoly over the right to distribute that "idea". If copyright infringement is like an old fashioned crime, it's like trespassing. The government granted someone the right to control who has access to some land, and a trespasser violates that law.
I wish piracy was stealing, I want to constantly download Ubisofts games until they go bankrupt
I suppose that is true if you download the from their site.
Now wait a damn minute.
So what? A company pays devs, story writers, testers, etc etc to build a game over the course of months or years, and then they release copy 1 which pirate cracker 1 promptly buys.
You, every nitwit in this thread, and everyone else then take a "ToTalLy FreE" copy ("it's not stealing" so who cares?!) because obv developer is not out anything. And then? What?
Who recoops the game cost? How is it determined whether or not to make a sequel if some angel donor covers total cost? It makes no fucking sense.
Sure, Ubisoft sucks, no complaint. But just because it's digital doesn't mean this brain rot is universally true. It's like some perverse form of libertarianism: I don't want to pay any taxes or tolls or whatever, but I wanna use all your shit. Every pirate here laughs and says "I got mine" but you're a bunch of moochers who try to convince yourselves you're in the right instead of thanking those of us actually buying the content.
I've sailed the seas in my day, but I never got it in my head it was a totally cool and reasonable victimless action. You can say "I couldn't have afforded it anyway", but that argument isnt universal and it doesn't make everyone entitled to a free lunch.
Your line of reasoning is exactly the same as if a company -- for the sake of argument, let's say Ubisoft for absolutely no particular reason whatsoever -- made a shitty product that no one actually wanted to buy, and therefore only sold six copies.
Who "recoups" the cost then? Nobody. That's called the inherent risk of operating a business.
It's also why indie developers in this day and age typically wind up considerably more successful for both themselves and their employees, because they don't need to outlay the enormous bloated expenditures of the AAA studios and publishers, nor go to such extreme lengths to desperately rake in enough revenue to break even.
If they make a shitty title, the company is forced to eat it. After multiples of those, they go out of business because they can't pay devs.
The counter argument is what? That game sucks so I deserve a copy? There is no reason to freeload off of either one. Sure sail the seas if you have to, but claiming you're in the right to do so no matter what is pants on head stupid.
Or, what if a government granted a monopoly on sidewalks within the city to SideWalking Inc. SideWalking spent all kinds of money setting up turnstiles all over the busiest sidewalks equipped with NFC readers, then ran an ad campaign telling people where to buy their sidewalk authorization cards, etc. And then they realized that people were just hopping over the turnstiles! Who recoups the cost to put up all the turnstiles and install all the NFC readers?
The only thing media producers [Party A] is deprived of is a little bit of money they feel entitled to every time [Party B] appreciates & consumes A's media. If hundreds & thousands of B's are appreciating & consuming A's media, the financial losses begin to add up after A put so much work, effort, training, time, passion & resources into it, only to not get paid for all that effort.
How would you feel if you worked your ass off at work then didn't get paid because your employer felt invisible & untraceable and felt like they could get away with not paying you?
How would I feel if I produced a lot of value and my employer gave me only part of it while keeping the rest for themselves because they can get away with it?
Like 99% of people
Hire your own people and make your own shit. You are now an indie game dev.
If everybody is pirating your shit, it's not making any value and nobody who worked on it gets anything at all. And anyone who IS paying I guess is just a sucker? Not the real heroes carrying your mooching ass to every game you want to play?
No, the media producers aren't deprived of money, they're deprived of control. They often do use that control to make money.
There are no losses. There may be missed opportunities to make sales, but that isn't the same thing as losses.
Sure, "passion". I'm sure that a lot of people pirate things passionately too.
As for how I'd feel? I'd probably feel bad if I depended on the current crooked copyright system to make money and then I wasn't making as much money as I hoped. But, that doesn't make the current crooked copyright system right. Similarly, if I were a manor lord in the middle ages and depended on peasants to work my land and the peasants ran away, I'd feel like I was being cheated. That doesn't mean that that was a good system either.
Interesting how you quoted "work, effort, training, time, and passion," while you conveniently disregarded the "work, effort, training and time" that media producers invest. You think they don't deserve to earn money for their work & effort & training & time?
Do you feel that YOU deserve to get paid for your work & effort & training & time?
I know you think you already answered that question, but you really didn't. So I'll ask you again:
Do you feel like YOU deserve to get paid for your work & effort & training & time?
No, I deserve to be paid what people have agreed to pay me. The work and effort and so-on is irrelevant.
Understandable. So what if people don't agree to pay you but want your product anyway? That's what we're dealing with here.
By "product" do you mean idea?
We're talking about people pirating movies and video games and music. That's the product. And it applies to anything. If I want something, I need to pay for it. That's how the world works.
Movies, video games and music aren't "products".
Yes, it is. Isn't that a shame? They've convinced you that that's normal, when it isn't. We could make the world a better place.
Are you a moron?
Nobody can ever make anything digital because you can just get a free copy and you're entitled to it?
I can design and sell shoes but I can't write a book after the creation of the Internet bc Merc is entitled to a copy because he wants one and you can download it?
Would you steal this too if you could?
Steal what?
A beautiful video game made by someone who quit working for Bethesda. He's a solo, self-published developer. Let me guess, You have no conscience that would stand in the way of stealing from him either.
Stealing what from him?
All that's happening here is a bunch of computer nerds have figured out how to get things for free, and declare they have the right to steal things simply because they can.
Same thing as all the looters in California who know that they can steal up to $1,000 of merchandise from any brick and mortar store, with no consequences. So gangs of kids in black hoodies are going into stores and filling up their bags and running out the door with $999 of unpaid merchandise per kid, and there's nothing any of the store clerks can do, and the police won't even come out to intervene.
So now all the stores can do is lock up all the merchandise behind plexiglass cases and now any normal Shopper has to ask a store employee to unlock each item they want to purchase, and the employee has to carry it to the front of the store until the customer pays for it.
Is this the kind of world you want to live in?
I mean I kinda wish we could go back to the days when people's hands were cut off when they're caught stealing. That might incentivize people to stop stealing stuff that other people produced for sale in order to earn a livelihood.
No, all that's happened is that the state has convinced you that it's reasonable to grant someone a monopoly on the expression of an idea that lasts something like 120 years. I bet you've never even stopped to question that, or that you even know what the length of the original copyright term is. I bet you don't know the history of Hollywood, and how it ties in with copyright infringement. Or, how when the US was a new country it immediately ignored all the copyrights imposed by the British monarch.
Suuuuure... That happened. And now you're conflating theft with copyright infringement again. They're not at all the same.
Why would they be running out the door if there are no consequences? It's almost as if there would be consequences if they were caught.
You mean, the current world? The one that works according to the rules you're advocating?
You have issues and I'm glad I don't know you in real life. Goodbye.
In other words "You're right, I don't know anything about copyright."
Jesus Christ you are insufferable. And you don't know anything about money or the exchange of goods or services for other goods or services.
You're the fucker standing in the back of the theatre having not bought a ticket saying "the cast would have the show anyway! So no problem!".
Hey, you're that guy who doesn't know anything about copyright, but has strong opinions, right?
No I'd be the guy with patents and licensed software who has observed you are full of shit.
You bought Winzip!?