this post was submitted on 05 Aug 2024
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The brazen appearance of white supremacist groups in Nashville left the city grappling with how to confront hateful speech without violating First Amendment protections.

They first arrived at the beginning of July: dozens of masked white supremacists, shuffling out of U-Hauls, to march through Nashville carrying upside-down American flags.

A week later, members of a separate neo-Nazi group, waving giant black flags with red swastikas, paraded along the city’s famed strip of honky-tonks and celebrity-owned bars. The neo-Nazis poured into the historic Metro courthouse to disrupt a City Council meeting, harassed descendants of Holocaust survivors and yelled racist slurs at young Black children performing on a downtown street.

The appearance of white nationalists on the streets of a major American city laid bare the growing brazenness of the two groups, the Patriot Front and the Goyim Defense League. Their provocations enraged and alarmed civic leaders and residents in Nashville, causing the city to grapple with how to confront the groups without violating free speech protections.

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[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 3 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Like, demanding police chiefs to arrest Nazis under the same circumstances that they arrest left-wing protesters is not going to magically diminish the work of left-wing lawyers and politicians to redefine the rules so that protesters, in general, are not being arrested.

That... was literally what I was saying.

[–] PugJesus@lemmy.world 1 points 3 months ago (1 children)

That… was literally what I was saying.

Read it again.

Like, demanding police chiefs to arrest Nazis under the same circumstances that they arrest left-wing protesters is not going to magically diminish the work of left-wing lawyers and politicians to redefine the rules so that protesters, in general, are not being arrested.

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 1 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Okay, but it won't happen, so what's the point of demanding it rather than just working to redefine those roles and working to elect politicians who will do so?

It reminds me of some vegans who go out and protest meat eating. That's not going to stop people eating meat. Working on campaigns to convince people why they should stop eating meat is what should be concentrated on.

I do not see what demanding they be arrested accomplishes when you and I both know they won't be.

[–] PugJesus@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Okay, but it won’t happen so what’s the point of demanding it

This you?

I see, this is one of these “never try” situations. We could never stop left-wing protesters from being arrested so we should never try to stop it and advocate for that to end

And furthermore, it's a lot easier to get cops to arrest people than to get cops to not arrest people.

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I don't know how I could have been any more clear that I was being sarcastic.

[–] PugJesus@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

... yes. You were being sarcastic. Which is what makes that response contradict your current point.

You mock the idea that we should never try to stop something because "We could never stop it", yet, then say, without any sarcasm or irony, "Okay, but it won’t happen so what’s the point of demanding it" on another issue.

Do you... not see the contradiction?

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 1 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I'm saying arresting Nazis won't happen but changing the laws to make it so that protesters won't get arrested at all is a possibility, especially on a regional or local level.

One relies on the cops cooperating. The other relies on just telling them they can't even be there.

[–] PugJesus@lemmy.world 3 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

I’m saying arresting Nazis won’t happen

Yes, and you dismiss the idea of attempting it because "it will never happen" after mocking the approach of "It won't happen so why try".

I legitimately don't know how to simplify this any further.

One relies on the cops cooperating. The other relies on just telling them they can’t even be there.

Do you... do you think the cops listen when they're told not to be somewhere and they want to be there? Do you think that's not cooperation?

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Yes. I think cops will not go places if they're told they will be facing things like fines if they do. They like getting paid.

And I think it's much easier to do that on a local level than telling them to go arrest the Nazis.

[–] PugJesus@lemmy.world 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Yes. I think cops will not go places if they’re told they will be facing things like fines if they do. They like getting paid.

So there's the power to coerce cops to follow the law, but not the power to coerce cops to do their job and ensure others are following the law. Do we have the power to make cops enforce any laws?

And I think it’s much easier to do that on a local level than telling them to go arrest the Nazis.

You think it's easier to make cops respect people's rights than it is to get them to arrest people they don't give a fuck about.

Okay.

[–] FlyingSquid@lemmy.world 1 points 3 months ago

So there’s the power to coerce cops to follow the law, but not the power to coerce cops to do their job and ensure others are following the law. Do we have the power to make cops enforce any laws?

Yes. It's called money.

You think it’s easier to make cops respect people’s rights than it is to get them to arrest people they don’t give a fuck about.

Yes, if it costs them money.