this post was submitted on 19 Oct 2024

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draw.io no longer free and open source software since August 27, 2024 (github.com)

submitted 2 months ago by schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de to c/technology@lemmy.world

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[–] Grimy@lemmy.world 98 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

We fund the project entirely from sales of the Confluence integration.

Just to extend the conversation, the change implements one thing, it protects our revenue in the atlassian ecosystem.

What it does it protect the future development of the project by protecting the revenue. That's more useful to you than the license being fully open source.

The primary losers of this change is anyone wanting to integrate draw.io into the Atlassian ecosystem.

I mean this does seem kind of fair. I'm not familiar with Confluence and Atlassian but it seems something mostly aimed at corporations, I'm not sure of how common it's use is and how much is affected by this though.

I'm okay with something being 98% open source so they can survive on the extra 2%. And I much rather specific non competes for certain platforms then broad non-commercial clauses.

[–] supermarkus 16 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I mean this does seem kind of fair. I’m not familiar with Confluence and Atlassian but it seems something mostly aimed at corporations

He should just use AGPL then.

[–] vzq@lemmy.world 25 points 2 months ago (1 children)

That’s substantially more restrictive than “Apache but you can’t sell it through this specific channel”, and it wouldn’t help this particular problem.

It’s not that the knock off extensions don’t want to share their code (they probably do).

[–] woelkchen@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Atlassian could sell extensions, though, they would just need to comply with the AGPL. The AGPL means that the entire platform must comply with the AGPL, so proprietary platforms couldn't use it but in a fair "applies to everyone the same" and not "we don't like you individually" kind of way.

[–] davidjgraph@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 1 month ago

It's a client-side app, AGPL doesn't work here.

[–] actually@lemmy.world 58 points 2 months ago (2 children)

None of the Work may be used in any form as part, or whole, of an integration, plugin or app that integrates with Atlassian's Confluence or Jira products.

its just the apache 2 license with a restriction to not sell this project on one marketplace. Can still sell the code elsewhere. Its still totally open source, and honestly Confluence is not something I would loose sleep on. Jira has been a cash cow for a long time, and I have a beef with them anyway

[–] woelkchen@lemmy.world 54 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (2 children)

Its still totally open source

No, it's not. Those restrictions are against the open source definition.

Edit: Lol, people with no clue donvoting what they don't want to hear. The open source definition is a fixed set of clauses. Read up on it.

[–] actually@lemmy.world 12 points 2 months ago (4 children)

I have a totally different view, if I can use it in my own projects, that are released with an MIT or Apache 2 or similar license, then its open source.

Not that I want to, but I could contribute to draw.io, or fork it and privately make changes, then make money off either the original repo or my fork, and its legal.

I could sell one line of code change for a million dollars and then start writing daily taunting letters, daring them to sue me, and I would be fine.

How is that not open source?

[–] vzq@lemmy.world 20 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Because of the “no restrictions on use” thing.

I’m happy this arrangement works for you, but it’s clearly pushing beyond the boundaries of OSI-defined open source, let alone Free Software.

[+] actually@lemmy.world -11 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I think anyone arguing that would eventually fall back to not so defined standards to make their point.

Ultimately, from my point of view, I am a developer who makes software that others will take advantage of to make their own profits. I have not made any ground breaking projects yet, but I am working on one the past year, and hope to have it widely used. Maybe it will, maybe not

But, my viewpoint is that users are greedy, they want everything for nothing. I also need users to want to use my stuff. Its a delicate balancing act.

I think ultimately, the op source code did it wrong in the beginning, if they had layered their work more, some of it open source, some closed source, they would not have the backlash now.

Maybe one day my own stuff will have similar controversy, or not! Either way, if people call my own stuff not open source enough, and I am looking at my bank account, I do not care

[–] vzq@lemmy.world 9 points 2 months ago (1 children)

TLDR: I’m too lazy or self absorbed to go look at the OSI website.

[+] actually@lemmy.world -12 points 2 months ago (2 children)

I honestly do not care, there are too many open source organizations doing their own plays for money and influence, honestly, in large, they are the best for progress

[–] vzq@lemmy.world 11 points 2 months ago (1 children)

You sure run your mouth a lot for someone who “doesn’t care”.

[–] theherk@lemmy.world 6 points 2 months ago

Well, there are many of us that do care about software freedom. If you don’t, I hope your software is as good as your understanding of open source.

[–] tja@sh.itjust.works 15 points 2 months ago

It's nice that you view it differently, but open source has a clear definition. And with this change it will not use a Open Source license anymore.

[–] cadekat@pawb.social 10 points 2 months ago

But you couldn't release your own projects based on this under pure MIT or Apache-2.0. Presumably you'd need to include the same restriction about selling on Atlassian's marketplace.

[–] woelkchen@lemmy.world 7 points 2 months ago

How is that not open source?

Google "open source definition" and read for yourself.

[–] einkorn 7 points 2 months ago (1 children)

It is still open source. However, it is not free software anymore.

[–] woelkchen@lemmy.world 2 points 2 months ago

You replied to a comment referencing the open source definition and it's clear you did never read it.

[–] davidjgraph@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 1 month ago

It's not open source, I've never called it open source, even before the license change. It's a public source code project.

[–] csm10495@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 months ago

Honestly good on them for keeping the spirit alive for just about everyone who isn't a direct competitor of theirs.

Let them make some money to continue to fund it. They even invalidated all sponsorships because of the license change.

Unless you personally were willing to fund whatever they make on their integration, then this is an ok play in my book.

[–] nyan@lemmy.cafe 2 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Hmmm. I wonder who is making so much money off this that the project is willing to push them into forking it . . . ?

[–] davidjgraph@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 1 month ago

Nobody, but if it got to that point, that would be too late.