this post was submitted on 11 Aug 2024
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I mean scripts like Shavian or Quikscript. Are these script useful to you in your day-to-day life? How are they better than the original scripts of your language?

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[–] frightful_hobgoblin@lemmy.ml 13 points 1 month ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

Cló Gaelach / Lámh Gaelach

Cló Gaelach means Gaelic print. Lámh Gaelach is the same thing but handwritten, it means Gaelic Hand. It's not an alternative to the Latin alphabet, just a dialect of it, like how German was written in Blackletter up until quite recently. Most letters are similar to the boring mainstream print, but T (Ꞇ), G (Ᵹ) and D (Ꝺ) are quite distinctive, and the letter H is not used.

There is no aspirated h (h as a consonant) in Irish, it's used to mark softened phonemes, so m represents one consonant and mh in Cló Rómánach (Roman print) represents a softer sound. Cló Gaelach favours the superdot instead of using h.

This is the part of constitution declaring Irish the official language of the country, with English a secondary official language:

The government phased it out for official use in the 1970s because they are idiots. I still use it when I can, I never write Irish by hand without it.

Ogham

Using what we've just seen, we can call it 'oġam' instead of 'ogham'. It's not a G-sound then a H-sound; it's a soft G more like English 'owam'.

Ogham is much older. It was used around the year 400. It is a tree-themed alphabet, branches coming off a central column, and the letters mostly have names like 'birch', 'oak', 'hazel. Ogham is climbed as a tree is climbed, which is to say it's written bottom to top. It was created by the god Ogma; similar to how Thoth created writing in Egypt. An 14th-century text called In Lebor Ogaim talks about various ways of putting ciphers upon it. Posts about ogham: https://lemmy.ml/post/16545296 , https://lemmy.ml/post/18046303

ᚔᚄ ᚑᚌᚆᚐᚋ ᚓ ᚄᚓᚑ but that won't display on all people's operating systems.

Ogham tattoos are common enough nowadays.

[–] Tangent5280@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago

Is this the one that was used to write on the edges of rectangular columns? Like with a chisel amd hammer?

[–] Plasma@lemmy.ml 10 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

ᛁᛏᛋ᛫ᛒᛖ‍ᛡᛋᛏ᛫ᚩᚠ᛫ᛟᚠ‍ᚠ᛫ᚱᚣ‍ᚹᚾᛉ᛬ᛁᛏᛋ᛫ᚠᚢᚾ᛫ᛒᚢᛏ᛫ᚾᚩᛏ᛫ᛡᚣ‍ᚹᛋᚠᛟᛚ᛫ᚻᚪᚻᚪ


Letter by letter:

Its beist of uv ruwnz. Its fun but not yuwsful haha


It's based off of runes. It's fun but not useful haha

https://rune.school

[–] sbv@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 month ago (2 children)

I hadn't heard about them until now. Here's a Wikipedia article.

As a parent teaching kids to read, I'd love an alphabet that didn't have the stupid ambiguities of current English. Trying to explain to a kid that "c" can make a few different sounds is a pain in the butt.

[–] frightful_hobgoblin@lemmy.ml 8 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

The writing system has its flaws too.

  • I and l look the same.
  • 0 and O look the same.
  • Why are their two totally different cases? Q looks nothing like q and the distinction serves no communicative purpose
  • Similarly, why is there printed letters and joined-up letters – two totally different ways of writing?
  • Loops are sometimes merely stylistic, but some letters like say b has a loop that is essential to it.
  • b and d are mirror-images, and this confuses some children
  • "dot your I-s and cross your T-s" – the pen has to be lifted from the page to do this, so people don't always bother.

Some of these might sound like non-issues to grown-ups, but they're hard for children.

[–] fjordbasa@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

joined-up letters

Do you mean cursive?

[–] evasive_chimpanzee@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago

In my experience, "joined up" is the British English way of referring to the mostly informal way that people write "joining up" their letters. I don't think it's as formally structured and taught like it is (was?) in America, where pretty much every letter is different than in print.

[–] Nemo@midwest.social 2 points 1 month ago

It makes one sound followed by E or I and the other the rest of the time. Mostly.

[–] Hjalamanger@feddit.nu 4 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (2 children)

Does one two one representations of the Latin alfabet count? In such case I'd mention a cipher used in Sweden called "brädgårdschiffer". Here is "hej på dig!" written using brädgårdschiffer with my very sloppy writing on my phone:

Hej på dig!

It's decrypted by matching up the shape and amount of dots with the letters in the key below. You look at the edges around the letters and the dots above that square.

key for brädgårdschiffer. This image is broken (:

I do however think that this chiffer probably exists outside of Sweden under some other name and other letters included (note that W and Q aren't included in the key. They aren't really used for in Swedish, apart from loans from other languages)

[–] velox_vulnus@lemmy.ml 7 points 1 month ago (1 children)

You were talking about this, right?

Key

note that W and Q aren’t included in the key

I suppose that V and K can be used as substitutes for loan-words?

[–] Hjalamanger@feddit.nu 3 points 1 month ago

Yeah, sure you can just substitute out the letters or write them out as is. And thanks for the image, i always get problems with images proxyed through ddg and then my instance

[–] Moonguide@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Hm, have studies been made on this cipher related to dyslexia? I'm not dyslexic but I've been reading into it lately (looking to get into UI/UX) and this seems like maybe it could be useful.

[–] Hjalamanger@feddit.nu 3 points 1 month ago

I don't know, but I would've think so. Part of the reason is that almost no one actually learns to read this stuff fluently without using the key and going letter by letter. So getting any significant sample of people to test it on would probably be hard

I can't read (or write) it without the key, however I'm quite fast if I get to do it. I have thought of trying to learn it completely, mainly to see how hard it would be and what I'd learn (apart from, you know, learning brädgårdschiffer) from learning a "new" alfabet. I'd be interested to see how I view it in comparison to regular Latin script. I speak somewhere between 2 and 4 languages depending on how you count and I've found every new one interesting and insightful to learn so it would be fun to see if learning to read a new script fluently would be anywhere near as insightful. Ultimately I'd like to learn Korean or Chinese but that be a major challenge and take a lot of time (also, I could probably not squeeze it in to my formal education with the path I'm going to take so I'd have to do it in my free time)

[–] 404@lemmy.zip 3 points 1 month ago (1 children)

I dabbled in shorthand (particularly Melin's system) for a bit. Never got up a usable speed, but I'm convinced I would have been unbeatable in uni if I had.

[–] velox_vulnus@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

What language is that? Svenska? Suomi?

[–] 404@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 month ago
[–] AdNecrias@lemmy.pt 3 points 1 month ago (2 children)

There's this pretty handy script me and folks around use for numbers, we call it Arabic numerals, even if the Arabs call them "hindian numerals". They're pretty handy. Beats roman numerals at everything but looking classy!

[–] velox_vulnus@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 month ago

I was talking with respect to modern, constructed writing system. Hindu-Arabic numeral system were borrowed from the Brahmi numeral system almost a few thousand years ago.

[–] AdNecrias@lemmy.pt 2 points 1 month ago

Jokes aside, hope people say which language they're talking about. Mine, Portuguese, doesn't really have alternate script as far as I know, unless you you count the old mobile phone shortened typing as such

[–] crmsnbleyd@sopuli.xyz 3 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Hindi and many other Indian regional languages frequently use the Latin script on electronic devices for casual communication.

For example, Kya haal hai -> क्या हाल है? -> how's it going?

I don't even know how to type the original script version.

[–] velox_vulnus@lemmy.ml 2 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago) (1 children)

No, I wasn't talking about this - this is basically romanization of Hindi, because phones with Hindi keyboards weren't a thing back then, and it kinda stayed that way.

What I meant was the constructed language system, like for example, the Bharati script, or the Manjikana system of writing.

[–] flamingo_pinyata@sopuli.xyz 6 points 1 month ago

From the perspective of a Hindi speaker Latin might as well be a constructed alphabet. It has less similarities to Devanagari than any other Indian writing system. It seems to organically fill the same role that constructed systems were meant for

[–] hanabatake@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

There were some that were made for french to make the orthography of words easier. They use accents generally. I do not use them and I do not know anyone that uses them.

[–] velox_vulnus@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 month ago (1 children)

Are you talking about Franabugida? This script is heavily inspired from the Abiguda system of writing used in South Asia.

[–] hanabatake@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 month ago

I was thinking of Adrien Féline (https://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k423752r/f42.image). I never heard of Franabugida, but it is very interesting even if I find it harder to read