this post was submitted on 17 Jul 2023
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Fuck Cars

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[meme] Trains are 100000x easier to electrify and automate than cars, so why does everyone keep talking about electric and driverless cars? (lemmy.world)
submitted 1 year ago by Fried_out_Kombi@lemmy.world to c/fuckcars@lemmy.world
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[–] HakFoo@lemmy.sdf.org 1 points 1 year ago

Cars fulfill a very self-indulgent narrative. 'I get to decide where and when I travel', makes people feel "free" snd "important" even when millions of them are silently coming to the same decisions-- like going downtown at 09:00 on weekdsys-- that allow huge efficiency plays.

Notice how many ads feature fantasies of open roads and trips to faraway attractions, not the real world of "I need to sit in rush hour traffic from 6:30 on to get to the Work Factory"

Maybe public transit needs to focus its message on the freedom from drudgery it offers-- you don't have to be staring at the driver in front of you, scanning the traffic reports

[–] BodePlotHole@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

I dunno what country you are from, but here in the US of A, the monopolies that own all the train infrastructure make sure to keep trains as public transportation as cost prohibitive as possible.

[–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

How many trains run from my garage to the convenience store at anytime I want? Or from my garage to work at anytime between 8 and 9 am and then home at whatever time I want to leave? What about the trains that run to my mother's house or my sister's house in different cities? What about the one that goes to the snowboarding resort I like it in the boonies, or for that matter, the one in the middle of the mountains? I will never live in an apartment with other people for many different reasons, and it gets both miserably hot and dangerously cold where I live. There are plenty of other things to fix before going after vehicles, especially electric vehicles. Making me operate on some strict schedule with trains and buses it other public transportation takes away my freedom to do what I want, and I will fight tooth and nail to make sure that's not taken from me, especially when both can coexist.

[–] Fried_out_Kombi@lemmy.world 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

My city has metro lines that run every 3 to 5 minutes all day every day, and riding the metro affords me the freedom to do something, anything besides keeping my eyes on the road. I agree that adhering to the schedule of a train that comes every hour (or half-hour) sucks, but it doesn't have to be that way. My city is also building an automated light metro that will run every 2.5 minutes.

If we talked more about building quality trains places, and building good bike infrastructure for micromobility like bikes and e-scooters, train + micromobility would feel far more free than being caged in traffic. In my city, that's how it currently is for me. Metro + my electric scooter makes me feel crazy free within the city. Only thing I wish is they would build even more trains, including to the nearby mountains so I could easily go hiking and camping, too.

[–] BassTurd@lemmy.world 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Scooters and bikes are not viable when it's literally freezing outside, especially with bad weather conditions. Unless there is transportation literally right out of my door, I would sooner keep my eyes on the road and drive myself. Trains and buses don't stop at the gas station on my way into work to grab my drink for the day, and if they do, they aren't waiting for me. If I need to run some errands, like go to the doctor or run to the hardware store, that is significantly less convenient with public transportation. I just got 4 bags of softener salt the other day that totaled 160 lbs. Not a chance I would try to lug that on a bike or carry it on and off a bus or train. I'm not saying I wouldn't use it sometimes, and have in cities like Minneapolis and New York, but I was visiting and either didn't have a car or wasn't in condition to drive so worked around it. Again, they can coexist , but fighting electric vehicles of all things is a dumb fight.

[–] chocoladisco@feddit.de 0 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Bikes work just fine when it is freezing.

Source: Have biked in sub zero often.

Btw it is possible to plan cities so you are not car dependent:

If I need to run some errands: I walk

If I need to go to the doctor: I walk

Hardware store: I walk

Do I need 80kgs of crap at home? Seldomly, but if I need it I put it in my bike trailer.

[–] Crucible_Fodder@lemmy.zip 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Yeah, but no train takes me from my front door to my job/the movies/my vacation place. And my car works even if the state decides to shut down the trains/buses.

[–] spiphy@lemm.ee 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

You seem to have a serious case of car brain, which is odd because you are commenting in the fuckcars community

[–] jannis@feddit.de 0 points 1 year ago

This meme is on the startpage, so many people outside of the typical c/fuckcars community will comment.

[–] aquinteros@lemmy.world 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

this is dumb on so many levels... i cant take my train to go to the supermarket

[–] strangematter@feddit.de 0 points 1 year ago

Um, what? millions of people do that

[–] BradleyUffner@lemmy.world 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Because trains are massively inconvenient to anyone that isn't living in AND traveling to the most dense of urban areas.

[–] DogMuffins@discuss.tchncs.de 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Some of the comments in this thread are bizarre.

"I can bike everywhere I need to go. Everyone should just do that and then we don't need cars"

[–] kugel7c@feddit.de 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

It's mostly a reaction to comments like yours that insinuate this isn't possible for most people, looking at population density where most people live paints a different picture though.

[–] DogMuffins@discuss.tchncs.de 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Only if "most people" only commute, with nothing more than a back pack.

There are so, so many examples but just this morning... I need to drop my pressure washer off at a friend's house, later I need to take my pregnant wife to a drs check up.

How can I do these things on a train or bike?

[–] kugel7c@feddit.de 0 points 1 year ago

Most trips don't need a car and even if they do there's rentals. Importantly statistics can show you that ~60 of trips in the US are <6 miles obviously very doable by bike. Also 57% of people live in urban areas where public transit should be very viable. Also at least electric pressure washers certainly can be transported by train and or bike, and getting the wife to the doctor should really not be more than a walk, otherwise you might be the one finding yourself in the minority statistically, living so far from a doctor. So please don't rely on personal anecdotes to argue what is the case for most people. Coming into a community called fuck cars and arguing like this (in bad faith or just out of ignorance) is the more bizarre behavior imo. The bottom line is we need far fewer cars and less infrastructure for them than we currently have. When we have fewer than 1/50 cars/person your edge cases might be relevant but we have 1/2 or more which is crazy.

[–] Froody@lemmy.world 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

I don't want to be stuck on and overpacked train or bus, dependant on train or bus schedules and like the freedom to go where I want.

Maybe cry about cruise ships and industrial shipping that spews out the equivalent of millions of cars?

[–] Krtek@feddit.de 0 points 1 year ago

False. More cars = more traffic = longer travel time at a lower capacity than what public transport could achieve. Also, if you enjoy driving so much, you'd very much want everyone else not being on your road, right?