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How to explain to libs in crisis that the US Constitution is antidemocratic (piefed.social)

submitted 4 days ago by the_abecedarian@piefed.social to c/socialism@beehaw.org

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Part of what I see with 50501/Hands Off protests is that they have a theme of "defending the Constitution" from Trump. This is really a somewhat conservative position and doesn't have much historical rigor to it.

Prof. Aziz Rana of Boston College Law School is having a moment on Jacobin Radio right now. His basic thesis is that the Constitutional order is so deeply antidemocratic that the left argued with itself and the liberals over whether to focus efforts on challenging it in the early 20th Century. In the broad sweep of history since then, Americans have come to view the Constitution as a sacred text, but in fact, that order is part of what gives the Republicans and the far right their advantages despite losing the popular vote.

The shorter interview: https://www.leftbusinessobserver.com/Radio.html#S250424 (April 24, 2025)
The 4-part long interview: https://thedigradio.com/archive/ (see the Aziz Rana episodes starting in April 2025) - Part 4 isn't up yet.

So why should we venerate the Constitution, when it holds us back from real, direct democracy? I think part of what our liberal friends and family hold onto is a trust in the Constitution and the framers. They weren't geniuses, they were landowners worried about kings taking their property. Use these interviews, or Prof. Rana's book, to handle those arguments.

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[–] millie@beehaw.org 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

You believe words have power or you wouldn't be out here trying to sabotage us with them.

[–] PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Ding ding ding you broke the code lol.

I also like how, if you sort of unfocus your eyes and take a broad look over the comments, it's very obvious that the chief purpose is shitting on "liberals." There's very little interest in the topics about democracy and improvement of the government and people power that are the ostensible purpose for this whole thing. Basically, almost all of it boils down to:

There are all these horrible people running around who believe the constitution is sacred and everything in it is great but they are wrong it's just a piece of paper and also it and they are going to make fascism
And you are one of them, no don't tell me what you believe, I already told you what you believe, shut up listen to me
YOU'RE A BIG PIECE OF SHIT ARAGRABRAGREWHDBEFJKHEBF

[–] millie@beehaw.org 2 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Absolutely. It's just a way to demotivate the left and trick people with the best intentions into shooting themselves in the foot. These people are out en masse here literally because we're such a leftist space.

If you see someone posing zero solutions but shooting down any possible way of moving any cause that might oppose authoritarianism forward? They're a fucking MAGA cuckoo.

[–] PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Yeah. They're not all fakers, either, I've seen these people at actual protests too. The one time it's happened I thought about interacting with them but I decided it wouldn't go well and went and hung out with the pro-Palestine people who didn't feel the need to be injecting a whole bunch of leftist infighting (to the point that it eclipsed anything pro-Palestinian and the leftist infighting became the main thrust of the message).

[–] millie@beehaw.org 2 points 3 days ago (1 children)

It wouldn't be an effective strategy if it didn't sucker some people into playing along. At this point, though, I think it's more important to point out that this is happening than to make sure we tiptoe around the few people stupid enough to actually buy into it.

[–] jatone@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 23 hours ago* (last edited 23 hours ago)

some day you twits will figure your shit out and stop electing trash like harris and biden. until then shrug. reminder: the democrats just let critical portions of the clean air act reversed via legislation without so much as a single fillibuster. seriously you twits need to stop defending and electing these pieces of trash.

and no one is sabotaging you but you.