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How to explain to libs in crisis that the US Constitution is antidemocratic (piefed.social)

submitted 2 days ago by the_abecedarian@piefed.social to c/socialism@beehaw.org

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Part of what I see with 50501/Hands Off protests is that they have a theme of "defending the Constitution" from Trump. This is really a somewhat conservative position and doesn't have much historical rigor to it.

Prof. Aziz Rana of Boston College Law School is having a moment on Jacobin Radio right now. His basic thesis is that the Constitutional order is so deeply antidemocratic that the left argued with itself and the liberals over whether to focus efforts on challenging it in the early 20th Century. In the broad sweep of history since then, Americans have come to view the Constitution as a sacred text, but in fact, that order is part of what gives the Republicans and the far right their advantages despite losing the popular vote.

The shorter interview: https://www.leftbusinessobserver.com/Radio.html#S250424 (April 24, 2025)
The 4-part long interview: https://thedigradio.com/archive/ (see the Aziz Rana episodes starting in April 2025) - Part 4 isn't up yet.

So why should we venerate the Constitution, when it holds us back from real, direct democracy? I think part of what our liberal friends and family hold onto is a trust in the Constitution and the framers. They weren't geniuses, they were landowners worried about kings taking their property. Use these interviews, or Prof. Rana's book, to handle those arguments.

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[–] PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat 2 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Ooh ahhh so moral, 😍 so principled.

Funny, I was just thinking the same thing.

[–] jatone@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

Yeah you guys lack both critical thinkig, 2nd order effects, and a moral compass and its caused everything to get worse. 👍 Remember you lost. Maybe you should revisit your analysis and try harder this time.

For example: thinking a base heavily populated with antiwar individuals will support a candidate advocating for a genocide. Jfc you're idiots .

Its not propaganda to tell people what she supports. My entire argument is she and the Democrats are fucking idiots who can't read the writing on the wall.

She needed to give reasons to support her and her entire campaign gave her base reasons to reject her.

gaza
unwilling to commit to keeping lisa khan.
unwilling to reform health care.
unwilling to address economic hardships for the middle class.
willingness to gaslight americans over the presidents mental state. (Which calls into questionanything she says but thats just icing on the cake)

Jfc christ and you wonder why people didn't show up for her.

[–] PhilipTheBucket@ponder.cat 2 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I don't even want to make a joke about let's talk in a month, I want to be able to point to the material difference in Gaza. It's too horrifying to make light of or want to connect in any way with internet debate points. But yes, there is absolutely a material difference. Things were already hell on earth, and now they've gotten even worse. Beyond the slaughter that was already happening. Simply because you don't see it doesn't in any way make it go away.

I think I'm done talking now, and it sounds like you were already, I think we can go our separate ways.

[–] jatone@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (1 children)

Oh no they'll be dead. Just like they were under biden. If harris was willing to change it she would have committed to changing it.

Go read my edits ive expanded a few sections.

[–] gregs_gumption@lemm.ee 2 points 2 days ago (1 children)

lol, your mental gymnastics are impressive.

[–] jatone@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Na you're just incredibly dense and slow. The people of gaza died in September, you're just catching up to this fact now and thinking you're somehow insightful.

So in a month when they start digging the graves and you think you have some undeniable evidence that you were somehow correct in choosing genocidal asshole A over genocidal asshole B dont waste your breath you'll be as moronic then as you are now.

Harris ran the most idiotic and fucking misguided campaign i have ever seen and now we're all paying for it and you blindly keep supporting her run after she literally had the worst results in modern history.

Itd be funny if it wasn't so sad. Now we're entering the the terrorism stage of a collapsing democracy. Enjoy.