this post was submitted on 05 Jul 2024
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Rogues beeing Rogues (s3.eu-central-2.wasabisys.com)
submitted 4 months ago by EmpeRohr@sharkey.world to c/rpgmemes@ttrpg.network
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Rogues beeing Rogues
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[–] Allonzee@lemmy.world 114 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (7 children)

Reminds me of why torture as a means of information gathering is ridiculous.

I will absolutely tell you what I think you want to hear when you start stabbing me, whether its the truth or I ever knew it at all.

But I also hate you for torturing me, so If I do happen to know the thing then I also know enough about the thing to alter the answer to something false but plausible for a moment of relief while you act on it, because we all know if you're torturing me, you have no intention of letting me out alive.

This is why the lets be pals/wine and dine approach is more effective.

[–] GBU_28@lemm.ee 20 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Well, real pros say:

"Thanks for finally providing some info. We are going to go corroborate it. If you lied, or if we can't find convincing evidence your info was right, we will take this conversation up with your wife/kid/family"

[–] Spacehooks@reddthat.com 2 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Joel did that in last of us

[–] nodiet@feddit.de 6 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Joel pretended to do that in the last of us, only to turn around saying "I believe your friend" and killing the second guy immediately.

[–] Zoot@reddthat.com 5 points 4 months ago

Well they really shouldn't have stabbed him to begin with!

[–] ObstreperousCanadian@lemmy.ca 15 points 4 months ago

This is why I liked the how Torture skill in Burning Wheel does just this: you decide what the victim says. It's not true, it's just what they admit to.

[–] skulblaka@sh.itjust.works 12 points 4 months ago (1 children)

Yeah but I have a friendly cleric. Zone of Truth doesn't care about how you feel regarding your interrogation.

[–] HikingVet@lemmy.ca 7 points 4 months ago* (last edited 4 months ago) (3 children)

Zone of truth removes the need for torture. You can interrogate someone without causing physical or psychological harm.

[–] skulblaka@sh.itjust.works 11 points 4 months ago (1 children)

They do still have the option to remain silent, though, as per the spell text. It doesn't compel an answer, it only compels any spoken word to be the truth as you know it.

[–] Scubus@sh.itjust.works 4 points 4 months ago

Speak with dead + zone of truth, I now have an incentive to kill you if you don't cooperate

[–] Ookami38@sh.itjust.works 2 points 4 months ago

Who says we torture because we need to?

[–] joelfromaus@aussie.zone 2 points 4 months ago

Yeah, sure, but where’s the fun in that?

Pulls out skinning knife.

[–] NegativeInf@lemmy.world 11 points 4 months ago (2 children)

Which is why you get the deets, stab anyways, check for accuracy. If incorrect, revive, repeat.

[–] kautau@lemmy.world 3 points 4 months ago

The CIA hates this one weird trick!

[–] renormalizer 2 points 4 months ago

I doubt their soul would be willing to be revived just to be tortured and killed again.

[–] loaExMachina@sh.itjust.works 5 points 4 months ago

Read the manual.

Pain can be efficient or counterproductive depending on the individual. The threat or pain is usually more efficient than the pain itself. Your "let's be pal" approach is not far from the KUBARK's recommendations, but it is not incompatible with coercitive methods: On the contrary several of these consist in putting the interrogatee in a state where the interrogator is perceived as a reassuring presence.

Context about the kubark manual on Wikipedia

[–] Natanael@slrpnk.net 2 points 4 months ago

That what the brits did to get Germans to talk in WW2