this post was submitted on 17 Sep 2024
223 points (93.4% liked)
United States | News & Politics
7210 readers
345 users here now
founded 4 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
No worries about the Israel part
I would say that yes, it would certainly involve reliquishing land, that's the reality of the situation. I don't think there's any credence to the "abducted Ukrainian" story. On the off chance you mean POWs, they would surely be returned. If you mean the children who Russia evacuated from the war zones that it controlled, most likely the children with a surviving guardian will be reunited with them as has already happened, and the children who can't be reunited with a guardian (for any number of reasons) will wind up in the local foster system in Donbass. The Ukrainian government loves crying wolf about being the victim of a supposed genocide by Russians, but here as ever there simply isn't adequate reason to believe it's true.
To be clear, I'm not saying Trump would take any action an anglosphere liberal would approve of (though I think his stance on Ukraine is the one thing he supports that is surprisingly reasonable if it's true), I'm just trying to explain as best as I understand it the things Putin would take into consideration. This is of course all in the "pro" column for him, but it's also extremely unreliable (Trump could easily be lying about his position, though I believe he isn't) and doesn't make up for the much worse possibility of Trump dramatically increasing US involvement. As things stand, Russia is surely going to win the war, so it would be poor strategy to rock the boat with the wildcard Trump currently represents with respect to this specific issue.
Russia has placed approximately 20,000 Ukrainian children up for adoption to be raised as Russians, rather than returning them to their families after the invasion. It’s genocide.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_abductions_in_the_Russo-Ukrainian_War
They were children abandoned in a war zone. Russia needs to do something about keeping them fed, housed, and clothed. If it didn't, then it would still be getting accused of genocide, though in that case with more reason! Furthermore, Russia clearly and demonstrably is cooperating with humanitarian organizations to reunite families, and many have been reunited already. The accusation is alarmist nonsense from the perpetual self-proclaimed ethnic victims to justify their fascist cult to literal perpetrators of the Holocaust.
Rescuing them isn’t the issue. Plenty of NATO nations are providing amnesty to Ukrainian refugees.
The difference here is adoption. There are no intentions to return these children to Ukraine after the invasion.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukrainian-children-abducted-by-russia-left-with-psychological-scars-campaigners-2024-06-15/
Aside from the ICC notoriously being an American running-dog, charges are not convictions. We've already seen Russia cooperate with returning children, we can't say that there's no intention of it.
So you trust Putin to be more honest than the ICC?
Good luck with that.
The ICC is not trustworthy, and I certainly trust the objective events that even liberal media report on when they come into conflict with what the ICC says. I don't know what Putin says on this and have not cited him once because that would be absurd. You are denying reality in favor of statements.
I referenced credible sources (here’s another) substantiating the adoption of abducted Ukrainian children by Russian families.
You referenced your own opinion coupled with speculation, and attempted to discredit widely accepts facts from multinational sources.
Yeah. I’m the one who’s denying reality.
Kyive independent is not credable nor is it remotly objective, it is a mouth pice of the Ukranian government
So again you use your opinion to discredit a source without providing any substantiated information.
Your opinions aren’t facts. Maybe you should provide a reputable source to support your opinions before calling challenging the credibility of others’ factual sources.
I have provided the same level of evidence, that you have that it is credible or factual or not bias. You where the one that made the positive claim, as is typical rules you have the burdon of proof
second my evidence is ... BASIC meida litericy skills
You haven’t provided one link to a source in this thread. I’m done with your time-wasting. Good night.
you merely posted a link aserting that it was credible, I said that it was not, no one has presented a link over the credibility, my argument is that basic media litericy shows that this has severe biases and not truthful, you have provided nothing, we are still operating under asertions